View Full Version : crappy courses
jdquinonez
11-24-2008, 12:53 AM
so me and my buddies usually just go to two different courses and today i wanted to be different so we drive to the one in somerset and it was pretty much retarded. holes were super easy and you had to wind your way around playgrounds and basketball courts. it was definitely a fat waste of time. anybody been to a course like that?
Donovan
11-24-2008, 07:07 AM
so me and my buddies usually just go to two different courses and today i wanted to be different so we drive to the one in somerset and it was pretty much retarded. holes were super easy and you had to wind your way around playgrounds and basketball courts. it was definitely a fat waste of time. anybody been to a course like that?
Highway 30 in Nebraska was full of them. They were not much fun. The ones I played were all 9 holes (if the baskets were all still there) and the chances of hitting a kid playing in the playground was very high if you played after the schools let out. Nebraska had some nice courses also.
But that stretch on highway 30 was bad. I even gave 2 courses a 0 in the rating. Before going there I didn't even know a course could get a 0 rating. Check out my reviews for Plum Creek (http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=700), Chapman Park (http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=1103), and Cozad Muny Park (http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=516) to see if these were like the one you went to. Oh and don't forget to vote. LOL It sounds so horrible to give a guy a thumbs up for a review of a course that he gave a 0 or a 1/2 too, but at least you will know not to go out of your way to visit that course. :)
magictenor1
11-24-2008, 09:18 AM
I have been to courses where the course no longer exists but was still listed on the PDGA site. Another good thing about this site. Hopefully that won't happen to me again.
If courses no longer exist, I'd definitely prefer people let me know so I can deactivate the course from the site rather than hand out a zero. I'm pretty quick when it comes to updating stuff like that.
magictenor1
11-24-2008, 12:38 PM
That was a while back when that happened to me and we went back and updated the PDGA site. This site goes a long way toward making sure that doesn't happen again. It is much easier to get info here and to get someone to respond to an inquiry.
The Valkyrie Kid
11-24-2008, 01:10 PM
In defense of some of those crappy courses, remember that they might be serving a purpose in that families or the little neighborhood dudes on their bikes, these crappy courses might be the right course for them at this time. I've seen some reviews ripping a course because it was too easy but when I played it, there was a family with a couple of elementary kids having a great time learning our sport on it. Sometimes, they deserve a break.
In defense of some of those crappy courses, remember that they might be serving a purpose in that families or the little neighborhood dudes on their bikes, these crappy courses might be the right course for them at this time. I've seen some reviews ripping a course because it was too easy but when I played it, there was a family with a couple of elementary kids having a great time learning our sport on it. Sometimes, they deserve a break.
I can see your point but I think if you're taking the time to research courses in an area on this site, chances are you wouldn't be satisfied with a course like that.
The Valkyrie Kid
11-24-2008, 02:45 PM
I think I'm defending those little neighborhood pitch and putt courses that are so easy that most of us write em off as being "too easy". Those are great starter courses for the kids and families.
I'm certainly not defending courses that haven't been played in months, that are unmarked with the baskets taken out. Remember last spring, I notified you on an ex-course in Oregon called Simpson. I was glad to help get that one removed. There was no longer a course there and I didn't want anyone else wasting their time driving to that site and finding just a toxic lake.
Donovan
11-24-2008, 03:40 PM
I think I'm defending those little neighborhood pitch and putt courses that are so easy that most of us write em off as being "too easy". Those are great starter courses for the kids and families.
I'm certainly not defending courses that haven't been played in months, that are unmarked with the baskets taken out. Remember last spring, I notified you on an ex-course in Oregon called Simpson. I was glad to help get that one removed. There was no longer a course there and I didn't want anyone else wasting their time driving to that site and finding just a toxic lake.
I have not given a zero to course for being to easy. But if the layout is going to hurt someone, or there is hardly any part of it left, it will get a zero from me. If one little kid gets hit by a disc, due to poor planning and layouts, it would hurt our sport more than having that course there to begin with. We have to be responsible about this. So, those are the 2 big factors for me to give a course a zero.
I get to whine a little. I'd be happy to have even a crappy course in my town... or in the next couple of towns from me. I have no close courses at all and have to drive an hour to get the the closest courses. Yes I'd rather have a nice course in my back yard, but a crappy course would be better than nothing.
And since I don't get to play on actula courses that frequently, I can't say that I've played a really crappy one. A couple below average, simple courses yes... but crappy no.
valkyriefb11
11-24-2008, 11:57 PM
I get to whine a little. I'd be happy to have even a crappy course in my town... or in the next couple of towns from me. I have no close courses at all and have to drive an hour to get the the closest courses. Yes I'd rather have a nice course in my back yard, but a crappy course would be better than nothing.
And since I don't get to play on actula courses that frequently, I can't say that I've played a really crappy one. A couple below average, simple courses yes... but crappy no.
I like how your location in WV in in proximity to Maryland, you must be in the boonies ;) :p
I know what you mean though, I always think that in some cases a simple 9 holer that may be nothing great for me may be all some people have. Im lucky to have some great courses close to me. :D
YonderScott
11-24-2008, 11:59 PM
If there are baskets I'll make the most of it. I live outside Charlotte, where great courses abound with little driving. But I spend alot of time in the Southeastern part of NC where just finding a basket takes an hour drive. So, I've narrowed my fun factor down when I'm down there to finding baskets. If they are in the ground I'll find a way to make it a fun day.
gottafixit
11-25-2008, 12:32 AM
Hey jimb, 25 minutes was all it took for me to get feed up and want my own, scoped out the parks closest to me. now about a year and a half in the making, but looks like the city will be getting some baskets in there soon, and in my opinion I have created another great course for others to enjoy.
ERicJ
11-25-2008, 02:32 AM
If courses no longer exist, I'd definitely prefer people let me know so I can deactivate the course from the site rather than hand out a zero.
I believe it was discussed before, but I'll mention it again that I'd prefer to leave extinct courses on the site for historical purposes.
They should be clearly distinguished from active courses with something like a big warning sign and a grey motif instead of the usual green.
I can see scenarios where someone tells you about a course in a particular area but they don't know what it's called. You might waste some time looking in vain for it only to find out later the course doesn't exist anymore. You may have been saved that exercise in futility if you could have seen an entry for the course on DGCR and it was listed as extinct.
ERic
Donovan
11-25-2008, 06:57 AM
I believe it was discussed before, but I'll mention it again that I'd prefer to leave extinct courses on the site for historical purposes.
They should be clearly distinguished from active courses with something like a big warning sign and a grey motif instead of the usual green.
I can see scenarios where someone tells you about a course in a particular area but they don't know what it's called. You might waste some time looking in vain for it only to find out later the course doesn't exist anymore. You may have been saved that exercise in futility if you could have seen an entry for the course on DGCR and it was listed as extinct.
ERic
I'm with ERicJ on this one...It just needs a big red, CLOSED or GONE on all the pages for it though. You never know when someone living there may want to petition it back in and this would be their reference.
Well, I don't delete the courses, just "hide" them. I have a thing on my to-do list regarding making those viewable. I just haven't had a chance to work on it yet.
Donovan
11-25-2008, 07:30 AM
Well, I don't delete the courses, just "hide" them. I have a thing on my to-do list regarding making those viewable. I just haven't had a chance to work on it yet.
You need an assistant bro! Your "to do" list is a monster! (like 0 putts counted in averages, LOL, just messing with you) We love all you do though, because this is the best place going in my opinion. Thanks brother!
What do you think would be a good term for courses that no longer exist? This will be shown across the top of the course listing for these courses.
"Course Extinct"?
ERicJ
11-25-2008, 11:40 AM
like 0 putts counted in averagesOh yeah, I forgot about that one... putts=0 should totally be allowed.
ERic
ERicJ
11-25-2008, 11:42 AM
What do you think would be a good term for courses that no longer exist? This will be shown across the top of the course listing for these courses.
"Course Extinct"?
Seems like an accurate description to me:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/extinct
Ok.. I have to tie up a few loose ends with this but extinct courses should be viewable later today. They won't show up in near by course lists, they won't show in the map or the course browser. You will pretty much need to know the URL to see the course. I wasn't planning on allowing them to be marked as played/favorited/wishlisted but on second thought, I guess that might not be a bad idea. You won't be able to update any information on these courses, add reviews, etc. since it would be rather pointless.
In your profiles, instead of showing up gray & unclickable, they'll have a little headstone icon. The entire theme for the course will be gray as well except for a few images.
ERicJ
11-25-2008, 12:58 PM
Needing to know the URL is sort of unrealistic, isn't it?
I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to include them in the course browser. Just add another check box for "Show Extinct Courses" and default it to "off". Search results for extinct courses would have the headstone icon similar to the pay-to-play, private, and photos icons.
I also think you should be able to mark them as played. For those that want to backfill history they should be able to add rounds to their DGCR Scorebook at those courses too.
And lastly, regarding reviews for Extinct courses... there is a benefit to having them. An Extinct course may have had some phenomenal features that could be documented in a review for future reference. Conversely, and more likely, it may have had some awful features that lead to its downfall that should never be replicated on another course. That's also good to document. And finally there are probably some obsessive people out there who like to review every course they've played. They want to see that "50 Played" and "50 Reviewed" total. :)
ERic
Well they are now available to view.. here's an example.
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=290&mode=ci
Regarding showing them in the course directory, I'll add an option for the list view if I can jam it in there but they definitely won't show up on the maps, near by courses, etc. You *can* add them to your favorites/played/wishlsited list though.
I have always excluded these courses from the scorebook but I'll consider opening that up. As far as reviews, I'm going to keep those turned off. I see this as more of an "archive" type of thing versus the usual course listing.
ERicJ
11-25-2008, 02:51 PM
Looks pretty good. Though I think the default graphic when there's no photos would look better if it too were grey instead of the default green.
ERic
Extinct courses are now optional to view in the course directory. Regarding the place holder, yea, it would look better but I'm trying to limit all my changes to the style sheet only rather than putting a bunch of conditionals into the page to check if the course is active. Also, if an extinct course has photos, it's kind of a non-issue.
ERicJ
11-25-2008, 03:10 PM
I'll add one more reason behind lobbying to allow reviews for Extinct courses: Because sometimes they come back...
Consider the case of Camelot Park (http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=2673). I didn't get a chance to play it before it got pulled, but it was supposedly a very nice John Houck designed course. The guy who is running the tourneys in College Station is going to set up that course again with temp baskets. (Read more here (http://hfds.org/vbull/showpost.php?p=2964&postcount=15).) It would be nice if players could review the course after playing it.
ERic
If the course comes back from the dead, I can just re-activate it. It doesn't seem that a review for a course nobody else most likely can ever play would be too useful. The courses don't show up in a default search and I wouldn't list reviews for dead courses on the homepage so chances are the reviews would go unread any way you slice it.
ERicJ
11-25-2008, 03:35 PM
But the reviews would be there for anyone who did search out the course and wanted to know more about it. I just don't see the down side of allowing reviews for Extinct courses. But you are the benevolent dictator, so I will concede.
ERic
It just seems kind of pointless to me since the review wouldn't really be helping anyone. The other issue, if a course does come back from the dead, you'd have a bunch of reviews referring to it in the past tense which would be quite confusing.
WillA
11-25-2008, 04:48 PM
How about just CLOSED.
ZMan44
11-25-2008, 04:57 PM
I love listening to ERic and Tim discuss extinct courses. It is like in Vermont at the Ben and Jerry's factory where each discontinued flavor has a headstone in their "ice cream graveyard". Some days they put out small samples of the old stuff on the grave stones for the people who stop by that day to pay a little homage to each lost flavor. Courses are a lot like that. When they become "extinct" sometimes we understand; sometimes we're angry. But no matter what, they were a part of our beloved sport and its history. I am glad that we will always remember them.
And back to the original topic. I used to fear rolling up to a course on a trip that totally sucked. Thanks to this site, that possibility has been greatly minimzed.
The Valkyrie Kid
11-25-2008, 05:14 PM
OK Tim, I'm a little confused over this extinct/closed course issue. If there was once a course that is now closed, do you want us to remind you of it's previous life so you can place it in the closed courses file or whatever. I can think of two in Oregon including Simpson that was listed on this site and another in Washington that closed many years ago. I kinda like the idea of having them listed somewhere for reference value. Plus I think you should be able to count them on your course total.
Guide Me O Exalted One.
If they're not already on the site. I'd have to say "no" to adding them just because I'd prefer to focus on courses that are still around. Simpson is listed as an extinct course on here so you can add that to your played list if you'd like.
The Valkyrie Kid
11-25-2008, 06:24 PM
Can't list it as a played course. It was already dead by the time I got there. Didn't get to play it. Ok on the others though. And thanks.
I like how your location in WV in in proximity to Maryland, you must be in the boonies ;) :p
I know what you mean though, I always think that in some cases a simple 9 holer that may be nothing great for me may be all some people have. Im lucky to have some great courses close to me. :D
My brother lives near Valley Forge, PA and we go to Six Flags in Jersey sometimes. I'll have to put in some DG time when I head up that direction next Summer.
Hey jimb, 25 minutes was all it took for me to get feed up and want my own, scoped out the parks closest to me. now about a year and a half in the making, but looks like the city will be getting some baskets in there soon, and in my opinion I have created another great course for others to enjoy.
I'm slowly... very slowly... working my way up to this myself. My first post was a request for suggestions on getting a local course started. I have three nine hole courses layed out with my portable baskets at a local City Park, a local college and a local Middle School. I just started scoping out a nearby state park that has camping and a whole bunch of ground. I'm thinking that it might be the best way to go.
valkyriefb11
11-25-2008, 11:29 PM
My brother lives near Valley Forge, PA and we go to Six Flags in Jersey sometimes. I'll have to put in some DG time when I head up that direction next Summer.
Tyler is a must if you are in the area.
Let me know when you are in the area, if I can I'll try and meet up with you guys and play a round.
-FB
solomon.trenton
12-01-2008, 10:50 PM
the course in Cape May Court House, NJ is atrocious. it is only nine hole but you play through a public park and zoo as well as over a goose pond. It is ok for young kids and beginners but overall it sucks.
33tango
12-02-2008, 08:32 AM
How about just CLOSED.
Just CLOSED doesn't work because(i've read) there are courses that close every winter for skiing and re-open in the spring.
ERicJ
12-02-2008, 11:08 AM
Just CLOSED doesn't work because(i've read) there are courses that close every winter for skiing and re-open in the spring.Agreed. Something that is "closed" has a reasonable expectation that it might "open" again. "Extinct" conveys with an air of certainty that it's gone for good.
ERic
Rizbee
12-03-2008, 04:25 PM
I'm getting into this thread late, but I'm very interested in the extinct courses issue. I'm currently working on some mapping projects for the PDGA and part of the work is identifying extinct courses. I am using a variety of methods to do so, including looking at old versions ofthe course directory database and paper course directories. Is there a way we could use this web site to inform that process?
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