How many drives on a course?

[optidiscic]

I just played the Monster at Fighting Creek in Virginia..(having a hard time digesting and coming up with a rating) it was the longest course I have ever played. i say this because I actually drove full throttle over 30 times on that course. After playing Walnut Creek, Kiwis, Signal View, Sherando, and Poor House in the 18 hours before the Monster..my arm was shot...My question is how many drives is appropriate for a course. I'm thinking 18 is the obvious choice (with a couple putter floater ace runs or mid range soft shot par 3s mixed with some longer 2 drive holes par 4-5) Just wonder if driving over 30 times in a round seems excessive..oh don't assume I only drive 200 feet either...if youve played the monster you know what i am talking about.

[tallpaul]

Quite a number of courses out there these days where it takes two drives per hole on almost every hole; i.e. average over 400 per hole. These are the ones that are getting to 8 or 9,000 feet. These are the courses I call "big arm" courses. I don't find them all that thrilling. Not that I mind some long holes; but this makes for long and (to me); rather boring round.
At the same time; I most recently found my second five rated course (I haven't reviewed it yet). Nevin Park, Charlotte is 8,500 foot from the longs (which we played). This one however, was not only long, but required fairly precise steerage; i.e. was not open chucker holes; but simply; long fairways; through foliage that I enjoyed (also got to play with bikinjack; which helped make the experience enjoyable).
This craziness is more and more on the horizon for top courses.

[Cgkdisc]

Depends on the level of course. If you think about it, a novice player may need to throw their driver way more often than blue level players when both are playing the blue tees. Many of us will be driving more often than a gold level player playing a well designed gold level course.

The course designers that have done at least one or more gold level courses and have studied the type of courses needed for that level have settled on a par of 66-69 being the maximum needed to have a ball golf like challenge and experience similar to their par 72 courses. That works out to 6-8 par 3s, 2-3 par 5s and the rest par 4s. The second shots on par 5s would be like drives and maybe three on the par 4s. Maybe four of the par 3s would not be full out drives. So that gives us about 20 drives per round if you are playing the tees at your skill level. If they are tougher tees than your skill level then it might be 24-28 drives per 18 holes.

[optidiscic]

I have played many of these 8000+ ft courses but the monster actually required a lot more grip n rip which is a bit different than the fairway woods type holes like Iron Hill, Nevin, Nockamixon, Quakers Challenge etc. seemed that full on throws came in succesion almost in a drive drive drive putt drive drive drive putt rather than driver, midrange, putt or driver mid range approach putt. So I guess I am making the distinction between balls out hucking and fairway controlled drives I actually full throttled 30+ times during a typical round at nockamixon 8900+ ft I drive about 25 times and only 9 of these am i truly giving it everything i have i guess it just seemed an inordinate amount of driving to me to throw 30 full out drives ..thats 3x what i throw at nocky and the distances overall are comparable. There was a lacking of approach and fairway driver golf is what i am trying to convey...so what is a reasonable number...perhaps Avery Johnson can full throttle drive less than 20 times on the monster but I doubt it

[optidiscic]

Depends on the level of course. If you think about it, a novice player may need to throw their driver way more often than blue level players when both are playing the blue tees. Many of us will be driving more often than a gold level player playing a well designed gold level course.

The course designers that have done at least one or more gold level courses and have studied the type of courses needed for that level have settled on a par of 66-69 being the maximum needed to have a ball golf like challenge and experience similar to their par 72 courses. That works out to 6-8 par 3s, 2-3 par 5s and the rest par 4s. The second shots on par 5s would be like drives and maybe three on the par 4s. Maybe four of the par 3s would not be full out drives. So that gives us about 20 drives per round if you are playing the tees at your skill level. If they are tougher tees than your skill level then it might be 24-28 drives per 18 holes.

I was crunching this in my head the same way Chuck and I came up with 22 so that seems like we are on the same page...i throw 300-350 so i am average on my best day but I don't think many DGers have the arm for the course i am talking about... I also was wondering if 27 holers should perhaps attempt to keep the number of drives in the 20s as well..sprinkling in some floaters or shorter holes here and there...

[tallpaul]

If distance is the same; I'm not sure where the drive, drive, drive every hole vs. drive; approach; putt is coming from. I have a feeling your were just feeling like the course was hammering you more today than on other days. Sometimes, the big arm courses chew me up; and other times I enjoy them...I think Nevin just happened to be a good day...though all five of us in our group enjoyed the course; so, there was something "fun" about it. Or, are you referring to the fact that there were some holes reachable; while others were just three grip and rips? The pure grip and rip courses are the ones I find pretty boring.

[optidiscic]

the front 12 is basically a bunch of very wide fairways that require a great deal of distance driver shots in succession...so yes i am referring to rip rip rip putt.
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course.php?id=3523&mode=hi
Unique wide fairways that you can actually throttle drives (I did misfire and required a pitch out and re drive..this may have added 5 drives to my total..but regardless a hell of a lot of ripping for the first 12 holes. Scroll through the pics and note the distances.
http://powhatandiscgolf.org/CoursePics.aspx

[biscoe]

...but then no full out throws at all on the last few holes. i don't throw any farther than you do but i doubt i threw more than 12-15 or so full out on the monster. (i think i shot a 71 from the longs if i recall correctly) it does feel like you're playing the same hole over and over though.

[fairweather_fan]

perhaps Avery Johnson can full throttle drive less than 20 times on the monster but I doubt it

this guy? he used to 'drive' the lane pretty well, but i don't know about keeping it in the fairway...;)
http://layupdrill.com/wp-content/uploads/avery_johnson.jpg

[optidiscic]

this guy? he used to 'drive' the lane pretty well, but i don't know about keeping it in the fairway...;)
http://layupdrill.com/wp-content/uploads/avery_johnson.jpg

Haha yeah u got me. Was gonna say Steve Avery Good catch my bad

[optidiscic]

...but then no full out throws at all on the last few holes. i don't throw any farther than you do but i doubt i threw more than 12-15 or so full out on the monster. (i think i shot a 71 from the longs if i recall correctly) it does feel like you're playing the same hole over and over though.

Your a better player than me biscoe. The more I think of it my arm was shot and if the last 6 were not tight woods I'd have a point. I think the reps of all that driving wo any recovery time made it seem worse. I overshot both intersection holes 7 and 9 and had to pitch out and redrive a few times so I think my total drives were higher. I guess I wasn't used to that or the 90 holes in the prior 24 hrs cauht up to me

[discflinger]

That does seem a bit excessive. I'm all for keeping holes under 500'. I don't mind them now and then, but one per course seems enough, to me.