My Star Roc is an Ontario mold. Would like RC too.

[gvan]

Was the Star Roc made in Rancho mold? I bought one that's an Ontario mold, but would a Rancho as this one is a bit understable right out of the gate. It has less fade than my DX Ranchos also.

Gerrit

[t i m]

Yes, I believe there are Rancho stars (I think I have one in my box of Rocs), but I'd recommend grabbing a Super Roc -- the plastic is very similar to star, and the Super Rocs are all RC mold. And the Super Rocs are much easier to find than star Rancho Rocs are. I think you can still pick up star Super Roc x-outs for ~$10-12; new they're only a few $ more than that.

[petecarp]

Yes, I believe there are Rancho stars (I think I have one in my box of Rocs), but I'd recommend grabbing a Super Roc -- the plastic is very similar to star, and the Super Rocs are all RC mold. And the Super Rocs are much easier to find than star Rancho Rocs are. I think you can still pick up star Super Roc x-outs for ~$10-12; new they're only a few $ more than that.

I second that, i purchased a super rancho roc on a whim and its is my go to midrange. release it on a hyzer watcch it fade, release it on an anny and watch it turn. i honestly dont understand why innova doesnt rep the super roc more, its such a great disc.

[DiscChainBasket18]

Isn't a 'Super-Roc' totally different than a 'Rancho'?? I had a super-Roc once & hated it. Big ol domey POS. Love my flat top Rancho roc's

[atl scott]

I always thought the SuperRoc was different than the Rancho as well. They do make star Ranchos and 2006 was the first time they made it so they haven't been around that long and they aren't easy to find. The cheapest one on ebay right now is buy it now at $39.99 and the most expensive is $124.99 and there are only 7 listings.

[gwillim]

Super Roc = Pro plastic roc made from the Rancho Cucamonga mold.
Rancho Roc = Any roc that is made with the Rancho Cucamonga mold.

There are also "San Marino" rocs and "Ontario" rocs. Made with the San Marino and Ontario molds, respectively.

San Marino rocs are a bit less overstable by nature and the Rancho rocs are the more overstable. The Ontario rocs lie somewhere in the middle.

Super Rocs are primarily made for World's fundraisers, while Star and Champion Rancho rocs are made exclusively for the USDGC.

The current primary mold is the Rancho mold. All regular production DX rocs are Rancho rocs. However, the San Marino and Ontario molds are still used occasionally for fundraiser programs, etc.


Any other questions?

[gvan]

Thanks, I checked out the one on E-bay and might consider it. I spent my self-imposed monthly disc limit on some darts and a KC Pro Roc though so I may have to wait.

I probably can't control myself though :)

splash_4 pointed me to a Japan open 150 class rancho in star, but I'd probably turn that over every toss...

[ERicJ]

Any other questions?
Yeah, how do you tell 'em apart?

[gvan]

It's part of the mold. There is raised lettering on the underside of the disc.

[t i m]

Super Roc = Pro plastic roc made from the Rancho Cucamonga mold.
Rancho Roc = Any roc that is made with the Rancho Cucamonga mold.

There are also "San Marino" rocs and "Ontario" rocs. Made with the San Marino and Ontario molds, respectively.

San Marino rocs are a bit less overstable by nature and the Rancho rocs are the more overstable. The Ontario rocs lie somewhere in the middle.

Super Rocs are primarily made for World's fundraisers, while Star and Champion Rancho rocs are made exclusively for the USDGC.

The current primary mold is the Rancho mold. All regular production DX rocs are Rancho rocs. However, the San Marino and Ontario molds are still used occasionally for fundraiser programs, etc.

Any other questions?

A quick correction on relative stabilities of the different molds: I agree that Ranchos are the most overstable, but most people consider the San Marino's to be in the middle and the Ontarios to be the least stable of the Roc molds. Extensive personal experience confirms that.

Even the Star Ontarios are straight or slightly flippy out of the box. You can put more on a San Marino and have it hold a hyzer line than you can on an Ontario.

Also, a suggestion for the original poster: consider picking up a Champion Rancho instead of a Star Rancho. The Champion Rancho X-outs from the last USDGC are still available for $17 each in max weight. They are sweet discs. The X-out Champ San Marinos are also still available -- also sweet discs, and have a great hyzer finish at the end (they are my go-to Roc for wind or hyzer upshots). Much cheaper option than a Star Rancho, and the Champs will hold up better.

But I still love the Super Rocs. Best VALUE for a Roc, IMHO. Beat great, last a long time, great grip, and cheap.

[ERicJ]

It's part of the mold. There is raised lettering on the underside of the disc.
It's really that easy? How unlike Innova. :|

[gwillim]

It's really that easy? How unlike Innova. :|

Lol, I'm sure it was a mistake somewhere, yet we benefit! Imagine that!

T I M;
Thanks for the correction on the Ontario vs. San Marino. I don't like either mold so must have flipped them in my mind since the last time I threw them. I'm a die-hard KC Pro roc thrower.

[Three Putt]

Yeah, how do you tell 'em apart?

It's part of the mold. There is raised lettering on the underside of the disc.

It's really that easy? How unlike Innova. :|

They just got lucky. The San Marino Roc was out before they had a plant and they put the location of their P.O. Box on the core. When they replaced the San Marino, they had opened a plant in Ontario, CA, so that location went on the core. When they retooled to the current mold, they had closed the original plant and moved to their current location in Rancho Cucamonga, CA, so that went on the core. So it's purely by luck that we have Sanny, Ontario and Rancho Rocs. Otherwise, we would be holding them up looking at the domes, which is the only other way to tell.

Although...I just got a Rancho that has a HUGE dome. :eek: I would have sworn it was an Ontario if not for the lettering.

[Three Putt]

Thanks for the correction on the Ontario vs. San Marino. I don't like either mold so must have flipped them in my mind since the last time I threw them. I'm a die-hard KC Pro roc thrower.The Ontario is like a Comet with less glide. You have to power down on it somewhat and develop some feel for the disc. Once you do, you can put it anywhere on any line you want. BUT...that's not how you throw a Roc. You are supposed to nut on a Roc and let the stability of the disc hold the line, at least that's how I throw a Rancho. If I throw an Ontario like that I'll overpower and flip it. Too much torque.

[petecarp]

Although...I just got a Rancho that has a HUGE dome. :eek: I would have sworn it was an Ontario if not for the lettering.

Rancho Rocs are the most stable because they have a huge dome. If it was not for the lettering and i were comparing various roc molds i would look to the domiest as the rancho and the least domiest as the ontario with the san marino falling somewhere in the middle.

[t i m]

Odd, the domiest Rocs I have are Ontarios... look like football stadiums.

The flattest rocs I have are all Ranchos -- especially the CHING Rocs. For those, the flat-topping makes them even more stable than regular DX Ranchos.

I don't think you can equate Domeyness to stability. At least, not as far as the different molds are concerned.

[biscoe]

ching rocs r.i.p.

[atl scott]

BUT...that's not how you throw a Roc. You are supposed to nut on a Roc and let the stability of the disc hold the line, at least that's how I throw a Rancho. If I throw an Ontario like that I'll overpower and flip it. Too much torque.

Agreed. I hate ontario rocs for this reason.

ching rocs r.i.p.

I am still having trouble believing they would do this to us. This is by far my favorite roc--better than the star ranchos.

[Three Putt]

Rancho Rocs are the most stable because they have a huge dome. If it was not for the lettering and i were comparing various roc molds i would look to the domiest as the rancho and the least domiest as the ontario with the san marino falling somewhere in the middle.Nope, nope, nope, I disagree. In high-speed drivers, domey=more stable. In slower putters and mids, flat is where it is at. The $$$ Rancho's are flat-flat-flat. The 8X KC's that were TO DIE for were flat as a pancake and even had a dimple depression in the middle of the flight plate...flatter than flat! The Ontario was always the domiest and least stable Roc.

[ERicJ]

In high-speed drivers, domey=more stable.
Not that I'm one to disagree with much of what ThreePutt or garublador have to say when it comes to discs... but... how do you explain the Z-Flick (http://discraft.com/prod_flick_z.html)? That's one of the flattest discs I've ever seen and it's pimped as extremely overstable.

ERic

[Three Putt]

Not that I'm one to disagree with much of what ThreePutt or garublador have to say when it comes to discs... but... how do you explain the Z-Flick (http://discraft.com/prod_flick_z.html)? That's one of the flattest discs I've ever seen and it's pimped as extremely overstable.

ERicSorry, I meant all things being equal domey=overstable. For example, if you compare two Destroyers and one has a big dome and the other is flat, the domey one will be more overstable. There are too many variables you can include on a mold that will effect stability to make a blanket statement like that to cover all molds. I've actually never seen a Flick (hangs head in shame :( ) so I can't comment on it personally. But from what I've seen if you had a flat-top driver with a wing that has a notch and a bead, those stabilizers on the wing will override to "domey top" rule and the disc will be overstable.

It is funny to note that the general rule of thumb used to be the other way around. I think you were the guy that pulled up the disc chart on the wayback machine that said "Flat discs are more overstable." That showed up on the Innova charts soon after the Rancho Roc came out, and it is true for the slower discs. As the faster discs came out, the opposite started to be true for those discs, so now it's too confusing to even put on the flight chart. At any rate, someplace between Speed 6 and Speed 10 that general rule of thumb flips. Neat, hun? ;) Sometimes I wish I knew more about the how and why discs fly...other times I'm glad I don't!

[t i m]

Not that I'm one to disagree with much of what ThreePutt or garublador have to say when it comes to discs... but... how do you explain the Z-Flick (http://discraft.com/prod_flick_z.html)? That's one of the flattest discs I've ever seen and it's pimped as extremely overstable.

ERic

ERic -- good example.
I think the mistake being made here by people is that this thread has drifted away from discussing just the Roc to incorporate other discs. Different molds are more/less stable in relationship to their domes. Back with the old CE plastic, flat used to equal more overstable. With some of the newer molds (forces, destroyers), more domey discs had more stability. Every mold is different.

My suspicion is that the dome actually has very little to do with stability. It's just that dome is one of the most easily visible signs that helps us to identify different batches of discs, probably cooling under different conditions. There is no universal rule (or even a universal generality) that equates more dome or less dome to stability. No anecdote about a particular mold will translate to other molds. So for discussion of stability vs. dome, it has to be done on a mold-by-mold (or even run-by-run) basis.

So back to the discussion at hand, most domey rocs are less stable; most flat rocs are more stable. But there are exceptions even to that rule -- especially among the Champion Rocs, where there are some really domey rocs that are still stable pigs.

[Three Putt]

ERic -- good example.
I think the mistake being made here by people is that this thread has drifted away from discussing just the Roc to incorporate other discs. Different molds are more/less stable in relationship to their domes. Back with the old CE plastic, flat used to equal more overstable. With some of the newer molds (forces, destroyers), more domey discs had more stability. Every mold is different.

My suspicion is that the dome actually has very little to do with stability. It's just that dome is one of the most easily visible signs that helps us to identify different batches of discs, probably cooling under different conditions. There is no universal rule (or even a universal generality) that equates more dome or less dome to stability. No anecdote about a particular mold will translate to other molds. So for discussion of stability vs. dome, it has to be done on a mold-by-mold (or even run-by-run) basis.

So back to the discussion at hand, most domey rocs are less stable; most flat rocs are more stable. But there are exceptions even to that rule -- especially among the Champion Rocs, where there are some really domey rocs that are still stable pigs.I don't think we disagree at all here. I pretty much took for granted that people understood that any comparison of flat VS domey had to be on the same mold. To take it to an extreme, you can't take a domey Roadrunner and a flat Max and say the Roadrunner will be more overstable. You could run over a Max with a road paver and it will still be more stable than a Roadrunner. I wasn't clear enough about that, which sent us off on a tangent. Sorry.