Need more spin

[skurf]

I throw RHBH 350'-380' but it's almost all torque and arm speed that produces this distance. My throws seem to have a minimal amount of spin on them and I just don't have that "snap" that I hear y'all talk about. So basically, I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions to getting more spin or snap on my release.

[sidewinder22]

Stop throwing/torquing the hell out of your Boss, and learn to throw a Teebird, Roc, Buzz, or a putter is best for driving form practice.

[skurf]

Stop throwing/torquing the hell out of your Boss, and learn to throw a Teebird, Roc, Buzz, or a putter is best for driving form practice.
I don't know why you assume I'm throwing a Boss and over-torquing it. Although I do have a Boss, it's a bit too fast for me so I don't even carry it in my bag. I do throw a Teebird and the Buzzz is my favorite disc. I'll use my putter for shots around 220' or less and a Buzzz or a Drone for 300' or less. I don't think my problem is disc selection, but rather form, or lack thereof.

[sidewinder22]

I assumed cause you didnt' say what you are chucking 350-380' with a lot of torque. Thats still a decent drive if you can control it.

Try slowing the pull phase, keep the disc close your chest and focus on acceleration and follow through once your elbow passes your shoulder. But it sounds like you are getting a decent amount of snap if you are getting your putter out to 220'. Its hard to say without seeing you throw though.

[trifocal]

I don't know why you assume I'm throwing a Boss and over-torquing it. Although I do have a Boss, it's a bit too fast for me so I don't even carry it in my bag. I do throw a Teebird and the Buzzz is my favorite disc. I'll use my putter for shots around 220' or less and a Buzzz or a Drone for 300' or less. I don't think my problem is disc selection, but rather form, or lack thereof.

Reach back deep as you can and then follow thru sharply on a flat plane/slight hyzer. ( RHBH) Repeat....reach back and follow thru sharp. Now...adjust your nose angle and try again.

[innova]

Start slow reach WAY back and finish fast.

Don't try to look over your shoulder at where you are throwing but allow your head to rotate with your shoulders, imho.

Follow thru!!

To maximize snap I keep my thumb very close to the flight plate outer rim and pinch fairly tight.
To force understable I slide my thumb toward the center of the disc. I have notice it decreases snap. (imho)

Sometimes when I get it right... I actually make a snapping sound when I throw.
It is my bird finger slapping against my palm that makes the snapping sound.

Learn to allow the disc to get ripped out of your grip by armspeed momentum, imho.

I keep my wrist locked, so to speak till I've pulled the throw across my chest then my wrist starts to have that last final bit of umph/ minor wrist snap for added spin.

Wow that is hard to explain.

[solomon.trenton]

try turning your wrist into your body more for your wind up.

[skottyb]

So I am guessing you are throwing around the 280-310 mark if you are having trouble with snap... Most golfers dont throw over 400, heck most dont throw over 350 with a tailwind...

why is there always so much exaggeration on these messageboards?

sorry what was the question again.

[innova]

I can throw over 400 and I am an old fart. It is a matter of will power too, imho.

[skurf]

So I am guessing you are throwing around the 280-310 mark if you are having trouble with snap... Most golfers dont throw over 400, heck most dont throw over 350 with a tailwind...

why is there always so much exaggeration on these messageboards?

sorry what was the question again.
There's no reason for me to exaggerate. I'm trying to get help with my form and it would serve no purpose to exaggerate. The distances are shown at my local course and when I land 40' from the pin on a 420' hole that's 380' (hole 16 at Pease) or when I land 30' from a 412' pin...you get the picture. These are my max distances though and I don't always throw that far, but yes it's usually in the range of 350-380 when I'm going for max D. My goal is to park it at the pin that's 420', and I think if I'm able to get more spin I could reach or even surpass that goal.

Maybe the fact that I'm 6'4" and have a large wingspan helps, I dunno, but I'm not trying to increase my e-ego by lying on a message board when I'm just trying to get a little help. Before I found this place I was throwing under 300' with the worst form/grip/technique possible, but by testing out some different techniques that have been suggested here I've been able to increase that to a max of 380'. Maybe you should try the same thing.

And the question was "how do I get more spin/snap on my drives" which you seemed to ignore because you got offended that I can throw further than you.

[skurf]

1. Start slow reach WAY back and finish fast.

2. Don't try to look over your shoulder at where you are throwing but allow your head to rotate with your shoulders, imho.

3. Follow thru!!

4. To maximize snap I keep my thumb very close to the flight plate outer rim and pinch fairly tight.
To force understable I slide my thumb toward the center of the disc. I have notice it decreases snap. (imho)

5. Sometimes when I get it right... I actually make a snapping sound when I throw.
It is my bird finger slapping against my palm that makes the snapping sound.

6. Learn to allow the disc to get ripped out of your grip by armspeed momentum, imho.

7. I keep my wrist locked, so to speak till I've pulled the throw across my chest then my wrist starts to have that last final bit of umph/ minor wrist snap for added spin.

8. Wow that is hard to explain.
I numbered them to make it easier to respond to.

1-3. I do fairly well on these aspects and I think is part of the reason I can get it as far as I can.

4. I'll try this out because I usually have my thumb more towards the center than what I think you're describing.

5. Never heard this sound with my own drives, but I heard it with this guy that I played with today, but I could still out-drive him a bit.

6. Yeah, when I have a good drive it's definitely getting ripped out.

7. I think this might be my biggest problem and what other people here describe as "wrist extension." I usually have my wrist in a straight line with my arm. I'm not sure if you are talking about the same thing Trenton is talking about...cocking the wrist inwards toward the body? It sounds like it though.

8. Hey, thanks for the effort! It was actually quite helpful.

[Lewis]

And while you're at it be proud you can throw it as far as you do. I know we all want to throw that next increment farther, but do take a moment to step back and appreciate what you've already accomplished. :)

[skurf]

And while you're at it be proud you can throw it as far as you do. I know we all want to throw that next increment farther, but do take a moment to step back and appreciate what you've already accomplished. :)
Oh, I do. And I definitely appreciate the help I've received here. I've gone from being the 2nd shortest thrower to the 2nd longest thrower among my group of friends that play disc golf, but I am always looking to improve my form, distance and accuracy. I will not be satisfied till I can consistently park the 420' hole I mentioned earlier. I realize this may take a while, but I've got plenty of time. Hell, I played this game for six years and was completely stagnant--never improving. Since I joined this forum about 5 months ago I've improved every aspect of my game, and let me tell you, disc golf is much more fun now than it was when I was shanking 280' drives the opposite direction of the pin.

[sumner420]

The snap trick, so I gather, is to pull back-at the split second the disc is being forced from your fingertips by inertia. As your body is spinning to the right (RHBH) your wrist is "snapping" to the left, against the bodies momentum hopefully generating more spin. The problem, I gather, is that an early pull will jerk a throw, badly. A late one just hurts the wrist. I throw a paltry 250 or so(a couple steps over 80 yards on a rugby pitch) so I may be wrong....
just my two cents.

[Omega SuperSloth]

i wish i had the problem of throwin 350-380 without spin , thats where i top out at and im using hella spin just to get that far without it id probally be throwin less than 250.

i dont know if u run up or xstep or whatever but you might wanna try standing still and throwing without moving your feet.
Im not suggesting keeping your stance like that but by throwing with mostly just your arm and not ur body it might force you to learn spin to get some d.

[innova]

8. Hey, thanks for the effort! It was actually quite helpful.

My pleasure. I spend a lot of time helping players learn to be more competitive. I enjoy that the most these days.

I applaud your efforts to learn your way thru a skill set plateau.

Many folks never get past that point, IMHO.

You da man...

[innova]

Footwork and momentum are another thing you can further develop, imho.

Think of it as learning a new shot... adding another club to your bag, so to speak.

Let me clarify... many younger big guns have a "skip" in their footwork to build body momentum during the first few seconds of a run up.

My point is working on different footwork can also impact your power.

[garublador]

IMO you're asking the million dollar question. If there were an easy fix to get past the plateau you're describing a lot more of us would be throwing fairway drivers >400'.

The problem is that it isn't one thing that you need to fix, it's getting everything to come together at the right time. Either rebuilding, or confirming, your throw from the hit back a la Dan Beato video is the fist place to start. You must have that late acceleration and correct timing through your whole body. Also, tightning up your grip too early or too much can limit wrist extension. Try to keep loose and feel that whip. The rip should happen later than most people realize.

[innova]

this guy knows D http://www.uoregon.edu/~dfeldber/golf/throwfar.htm

I'd venture a guess guys like this grip fairly firmly when throwing.
http://www.uoregon.edu/~dfeldber/golf/throwfar_files/image003.jpg

[mzuleger]

IMO you're asking the million dollar question. If there were an easy fix to get past the plateau you're describing a lot more of us would be throwing fairway drivers >400'.

The problem is that it isn't one thing that you need to fix, it's getting everything to come together at the right time. Either rebuilding, or confirming, your throw from the hit back a la Dan Beato video is the fist place to start. You must have that late acceleration and correct timing through your whole body. Also, tightning up your grip too early or too much can limit wrist extension. Try to keep loose and feel that whip. The rip should happen later than most people realize.

Always listen to the wise Garu. Seriously.

But if you know snap is what need this is what helped me a little: I try and keep my arm nice and relaxed until the last possible moment, at that point flex and grip hard. That and try to almost let the disc hit your forearm just before the release. That said it's not a real natural thing for me yet either... if I don't focus on it I probably won't do it.

[garublador]

Always listen to the wise Garu. Seriously.

But if you know snap is what need this is what helped me a little: I try and keep my arm nice and relaxed until the last possible moment, at that point flex and grip hard. That and try to almost let the disc hit your forearm just before the release. That said it's not a real natural thing for me yet either... if I don't focus on it I probably won't do it.This was recently brought up on the DGR board and Dan's advice was actually to not tighten your grip consiously at the end of your throw. It will naturally tighten if you accelerate through the hit and trying to do it manually will probably just limit wrist extension.

[sidewinding]

Look down at your disc from the top during the pull through and think of the disc as a clock. When the disc crosses your chest where is your thumb? If it's at 3 o'clock try rotating your thumb around closer to 12 o'clock. I do this combined with a few extra steps and a faster runup when I need to get over 400'. I never hear a snap but my wife always comments on how loud my snap is.

[BrotherDave]

I wouldn't talk to this guy then I guess...
http://5minuteswithmolly.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/10015_h_sw350.jpg
Sorry, couldn't resist.

[Jungle Tim]

this MAY help

its my experience of gettign snap

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showpost.php?p=45524&postcount=29

[SomeChump]

Ha ha. If you're relying on tee signs to assess your distance you probably are exaggerating. Best thing I did to realize just how far I can actually throw is buy a little measuring wheel. I was surprised just how far 300 feet really is. Much longer than a lot of 300 foot holes.

Likewise, measuring putts is very instructive. I have to have a pretty big weight shift to have a straight flat 30 foot putt.

[jace]

There's no reason for me to exaggerate. I'm trying to get help with my form and it would serve no purpose to exaggerate. The distances are shown at my local course and when I land 40' from the pin on a 420' hole that's 380' (hole 16 at Pease) or when I land 30' from a 412' pin...you get the picture. These are my max distances though and I don't always throw that far, but yes it's usually in the range of 350-380 when I'm going for max D. My goal is to park it at the pin that's 420', and I think if I'm able to get more spin I could reach or even surpass that goal.

Maybe the fact that I'm 6'4" and have a large wingspan helps, I dunno, but I'm not trying to increase my e-ego by lying on a message board when I'm just trying to get a little help. Before I found this place I was throwing under 300' with the worst form/grip/technique possible, but by testing out some different techniques that have been suggested here I've been able to increase that to a max of 380'. Maybe you should try the same thing.

And the question was "how do I get more spin/snap on my drives" which you seemed to ignore because you got offended that I can throw further than you.

i wish i could throw that far..... everything i read and hear about says slow your form down and FOLLOW THROUGH :D Noone ever talks about follow through on these threads. Like any other sport it accounts for half of all form problems if not more. I think you need to grunt real loud too :D

[skurf]

Look down at your disc from the top during the pull through and think of the disc as a clock. When the disc crosses your chest where is your thumb? If it's at 3 o'clock try rotating your thumb around closer to 12 o'clock. I do this combined with a few extra steps and a faster runup when I need to get over 400'. I never hear a snap but my wife always comments on how loud my snap is.

so you're saying rotate my thumb more to the center of the disc, but innova says rotate it more to the edge...what gives? Or am I misunderstanding one or both of you?

[skurf]

Ha ha. If you're relying on tee signs to assess your distance you probably are exaggerating. Best thing I did to realize just how far I can actually throw is buy a little measuring wheel. I was surprised just how far 300 feet really is. Much longer than a lot of 300 foot holes.

Likewise, measuring putts is very instructive. I have to have a pretty big weight shift to have a straight flat 30 foot putt.

I've used the measure function in google earth and the distances on the signs at Pease match what google earth says, and from other experiences, google earth usually has less than 1 foot margin of error per thousand feet.

[innova]

If I place my thumb in the center of the flight plate... or thereabouts... I do not get as much spin
as when i pinch the outer rim.

That is me. MMV.

I find that by placing my thumb in the center, I force an understable shot.

I throw pretty darn far and those max D shots are the ones where my thumb is on the outer rim.

Not sure what anyone else has experienced. That is just my take on the matter.

[kenjiac]

Look down at your disc from the top during the pull through and think of the disc as a clock. When the disc crosses your chest where is your thumb? If it's at 3 o'clock try rotating your thumb around closer to 12 o'clock. I do this combined with a few extra steps and a faster runup when I need to get over 400'. I never hear a snap but my wife always comments on how loud my snap is.

so you're saying rotate my thumb more to the center of the disc, but innova says rotate it more to the edge...what gives? Or am I misunderstanding one or both of you?

I think you are misunderstand them. Grip close to the edge but bend your wrist more so that your thumb is in a 12 o'clock position when coming across your chest. Think like having your arm in a position like your giving someone a headlock with your wrist bent in as much as possible. Your thumb is pointing back at your chest.

[amcarlson83]

I've used the measure function in google earth and the distances on the signs at Pease match what google earth says, and from other experiences, google earth usually has less than 1 foot margin of error per thousand feet.

Google Earth is much more inconsistent than that. I wanted to see how fast I could run a mile, so I used GE to map out the mile. I ran it at 9 min 16 sec, after not running in over 8 years, being out of shape because of college and having progressing arthritis in my hip since 2001. No one believed me. So I looked it up on a regular map... about 4/5th of a mile. Then confirmed by driving it and watching my speedometer. With 20% inaccuracy in that instance, could bring your drive down about 60 feet (ish).

[amcarlson83]

I have a natural "hurdler" type follow through after my best drives (803.02 compliant). The spin is fantastic when I throw like that, but little audible snap. I would do it after every throw, but its hard to recreate when I am trying to. Oh well, keep trying.

Does anyone feel it necessary to cut the "snap" calluses from your fingertips?

[skurf]

Google Earth is much more inconsistent than that. I wanted to see how fast I could run a mile, so I used GE to map out the mile. I ran it at 9 min 16 sec, after not running in over 8 years, being out of shape because of college and having progressing arthritis in my hip since 2001. No one believed me. So I looked it up on a regular map... about 4/5th of a mile. Then confirmed by driving it and watching my speedometer. With 20% inaccuracy in that instance, could bring your drive down about 60 feet (ish).
I don't know why you people are so convinced that I don't throw as far as I say I do. Not that it matters (although it is annoying), but this thread was not supposed to be about whether or not I can throw 'x' amount of feet or not, but about how to get more spin. One thing I can tell you for sure is that the ruler tool on google earth is VERY accurate, at least for the area that I live in. I work for a land surveying company and we use it when we go out to survey a big ranch so that the field crew will have landmarks that they can follow to get them in the right area. And what we've found is that the distances in google earth are never off by more than a foot or two when dealing with many thousands of feet.

Don't take my word for it? Here's an example of a football field and the hole that I'm talking about at Pease Park that has 420' on the sign, and they are both dead on the money.

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=864&stc=1&d=1242852502
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=865&stc=1&d=1242851896

[zenbot]

I don't know why you people are so convinced that I don't throw as far as I say I do. Not that it matters (although it is annoying), but this thread was not supposed to be about whether or not I can throw 'x' amount of feet or not, but about how to get more spin. One thing I can tell you for sure is that the ruler tool on google earth is VERY accurate, at least for the area that I live in. I work for a land surveying company and we use it when we go out to survey a big ranch so that the field crew will have landmarks that they can follow to get them in the right area. And what we've found is that the distances in google earth are never off by more than a foot or two when dealing with many thousands of feet.

Don't take my word for it? Here's an example of a football field and the hole that I'm talking about at Pease Park that has 420' on the sign, and they are both dead on the money.

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=864&stc=1&d=1242852502
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=865&stc=1&d=1242851896
Really cool. Thank you. I didn't know I had that ability in Google Earth.

[amcarlson83]

I don't care how far you throw. You said you are 6'4", in my experience with hullers that gives you credibility.

But it was wrong for me in that instance.