Violation, would you call this?

[BradC]

Would you conisder this a violation of 803.05(a)?
A. Obstacles to a Stance or Throwing Motion: With the exception of casual obstacles to a stance as described in 803.05 B, a player is not allowed to move any obstacle on the course. No relief is granted from park equipment (such as signs, trash cans, picnic tables, etc), which is considered part of the course. A player is allowed to request that other people remove themselves and/or their belongings from the player's stance or line of play. A player must choose the stance which results in the least movement of any obstacle. Once a legal stance is taken, the player may not move an obstacle in any way in order to make room for a throwing motion. It is legal for a player's throwing motion to cause incidental movement of an obstacle.


The guy walking up in black, when putting, in my opinion violates said rule.

Agree, disagree? Why?

<iframe width="1280" height="750" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/mCkZYCo0L38" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Ok, I fail at embedding, here - http://youtu.be/mCkZYCo0L38?t=32m56s

[GLong]

mCkZYCo0L38

where in the vid is the part you are referencing?

[Mr. America]

If you're talking about either of the two guys in black when the video first starts off, that's crazy talk to me. If they are bothering the guy throwing somehow, they need to toughen the hell up mentally.

[Mr. America]

mCkZYCo0L38

where in the vid is the part you are referencing?

when you click his link, his video starts around the 32:40 mark.

[curveball4]

I think he means when he kicks around the brush at his feet to clear his stance.

[roadtripstuff]

I think he means when he kicks around the brush at his feet to clear his stance.

That's what I was thinking he meant. He kinda steps on some little branches or whatever there and pushes them back our of his way.

[curveball4]

I would like to hear a rules "expert" chime in. Looks like he clearing his stance & not moving something that would have interfered with his actual motion. Is this considered the same thing?

[Mr. America]

What's he supposed to do? Hover?

[Cgkdisc]

He definitely should have slid his foot carefully under the live brush rather than disturbing it the way he did based on 803.04D, not the rule 803.05A in the OP.

[curveball4]

What's he supposed to do? Hover?

If he was cool enough he would! I thought you would have to adjust your stance around the brush without moving it but he clearly pushes it out of his way. Is this different than moving a low hanging branch to clear an open window? I have no clue if what he did is legal or not, that's why I asked.

[bradharris]

He definitely should have slid his foot carefully under the live brush rather than disturbing it the way he did based on 803.04D, not the rule 803.05A in the OP.

If it's alive, it's part of the course and should be undisturbed. If it's dead, it can be cleared.

But to the original question, no I probably would not call it.

[BradC]

when you click his link, his video starts around the 32:40 mark.

33 minute mark, the guy in black walking up to address his lie.

My beef is pointed out below.

I think he means when he kicks around the brush at his feet to clear his stance.

Yes, this is exactly what I meant.

He definitely should have slid his foot carefully under the live brush rather than disturbing it the way he did based on 803.04D, not the rule 803.05A in the OP.

.A wouldn't apply, due to; "A player must choose the stance which results in the least movement of any obstacle."?

Sorry for not putting more info in the first post last night, just saw that before crashing out and wanted to get some thoughts.

[Smigles]

I have watched all 5 videos over the last 2 days, and I have noticed at least 3 times where they do stuff like this.

[BarkBuster]

I was always under the impression that you could move brush/sticks/branches from under your feet if they were dead... hmmmm. I hate rules.

[BradC]

I was always under the impression that you could move brush/sticks/branches from under your feet if they were dead... hmmmm. I hate rules.

You are correct in that, but to me, these look like live ferns.

Let's all agree that for the sake of argument, these are live plants, still rooted in the ground and growing.

[Giv'r]

He definitely should have slid his foot carefully under the live brush rather than disturbing it the way he did based on 803.04D, not the rule 803.05A in the OP.

I'd agree with this. He doesn't look like he's being very gentle at all with that bush. It also looks like he's holding a live branch under his foot, which to me is the same as holding a branch out of the way with your hand. I'd call it.

[denny ritner]

i agree that this is a good example of a careless rules violation.

[Greatzky]

from my understanding with the one of Hasting making the huge jump putt... he didn't try to choose a lie that resulted in little movement of the obstacles on the course. he purposely stepped on one of the ferns/branches and he walked into the lie backwards so that the other one wouldnt be in his throwing motion. I would assume that this would be against the rules, but I haven't seen it called very often as the rule is not very exacting and needs to include examples(Possibly in next years manual?)

-Scott Lewis
Hyzer Flip Disc Golf

[atl scott]

Definitely a violation.

I have called similar at times, depending on the severity. People always say "stepping on this doesn't really help me any" to which I respond then why are you doing it when you could have taken a legal stance?

[IronJack]

What's the deal with laying towels on the tee pad?

[TonyAPE12]

What's the deal with laying towels on the tee pad?

Traction on wet pads. Personally, I think it creates a more dangerous situation as the towel could slip and then you're in for a rough time...

[Greatzky]

you can put a towel down on a teepad or on any lie you choose. there is nothing in the rules that would prevent you from putting a towel down for any shot.. It's just most common to see it done on a teepad.

I've been playing since 2003 and I've never had the need to lay down a towel. I don't throw over 450 either so I might be not creating enough turn/torque to need that much grip?

-Scott Lewis
Hyzer Flip Disc Golf

[notBOB]

i wouldnt call any violation here. he was a bit "rough" in getting to his lie, something i wouldnt do, but that really doesnt stick out to me. if i was on the card i never even would have acknowledged it..at that point i woulda been in the zone.

[Cgkdisc]

Greatzky - there is nothing in the rules that would prevent you from putting a towel down for any shot.. It's just most common to see it done on a teepad.
You may put down a towel on the tee pad. You may also put down a towel on the fairway, even folded until it can be compressed to no thicker than 1 cm. But the only supporting point you may place on it is your knee (per Rules Q&A). You may not stand on a towel placed in the fairway and throw.

[Giv'r]

i wouldnt call any violation here. he was a bit "rough" in getting to his lie, something i wouldnt do, but that really doesnt stick out to me. if i was on the card i never even would have acknowledged it..at that point i woulda been in the zone.

He was more than a bit "rough". He didn't just kick the branch around. He pinned the branch down and behind himself with his foot so that he could jump forward. It's exactly the same as holding a branch out of the way of your arm swing with your hand.

[Greatzky]

You may put down a towel on the tee pad. You may also put down a towel on the fairway, even folded until it can be compressed to no thicker than 1 cm. But the only supporting point you may place on it is your knee (per Rules Q&A). You may not stand on a towel placed in the fairway and throw.

yeah just read that in another discussion. thx for the correction!!

-Scott Lewis
Hyzer Flip Disc Golf

[Dfwdscglfr]

i thought you could get called on building a lie if you put a towel down good to know thanks

[prerube]

I was more concerned with the last putter who never put his foot back down after his putt. he was risking getting called for foot fault.

[MNcyclone]

Call him for abusing a fern? Certainly not, it wasn't in his throwing motion before so I couldn't care less that he treated it poorly. I don't cry for ferns.

Call him for a foot fault on that jump putt? Sure would, that looked like one of the more illegal ones I have seen in competition.

[Rocinfire]

What was the foot fault?

[Giv'r]

Call him for abusing a fern? Certainly not, it wasn't in his throwing motion before so I couldn't care less that he treated it poorly. I don't cry for ferns.

Call him for a foot fault on that jump putt? Sure would, that looked like one of the more illegal ones I have seen in competition.

That was definitely in his throwing motion. The branch was over his knees before he pushed it away and his throw started from his knees. Also, as I mentioned before, he wouldn't have even been able jump forward at all if the branch was still in front of him.

[MNcyclone]

What was the foot fault?

He released the disc when his feet were in the air from the look of it.

[MNcyclone]

That was definitely in his throwing motion. The branch was over his knees before he pushed it away and his throw started from his knees. Also, as I mentioned before, he wouldn't have even been able jump forward at all if the branch was still in front of him.

I guess it didn't look like a major impediment to his motion from the video, but if it were I would call it. Hard to tell how beefy that fern was in the vid.

[Giv'r]

I guess it didn't look like a major impediment to his motion from the video, but if it were I would call it. Hard to tell how beefy that fern was in the vid.

It looks a little more beefy than a fern to me. Also I'm really not too concerned about him kicking a plant, just that he kicked it out of his way to get a clearer shot.

[Script]

That's a violation, definetely. However, I doubt you see it called very often and I'm sure I've done it before. Whether or not the ferm would have had an impact on his throw is irrelevant, but I assure you that it is more comforting knowing that no ferm is gonna catch your arm while putting.

[Midnightbiker]

That's a violation, definetely. However, I doubt you see it called very often and I'm sure I've done it before. Whether or not the ferm would have had an impact on his throw is irrelevant, but I assure you that it is more comforting knowing that no ferm is gonna catch your arm while putting.

I agree. He stepped on it to keep it out of his way