Why don't people play their tee level?

[billnchristy]

We have a course with red and blue tees and the reds are quite a bit easier and I score between 51 and 59 depending on pin location.

Blues add about 600-1500' and I score 65-70 on these.

We recently had a tournament where rec/women/jrs. played from reds and everyone else from blues, the course was in the longest layout.

Most of the rec. players said they had never played reds but the best score was a 51 and I scored my personal best of 57 (+1). Obviously this is the level I am at and I have no problem with that.

I also like to play the blues because they are a bit more challenging.

Now what I don't get is I have seen people that have obviously not played much and could throw maybe 100' skyward and they still insist on playing the blues like it is some kind of badge of shame to throw the reds....which are also referred to as the "ladies or kids" tees.

Now I know some courses have silly shorts that even kids don't like to throw from but basically why the hell do red level (or worse) players act like they are better than red tees?

[Roc1Time]

Because they dont know better. They think the red tees are the ladies tees. I have seen many at my local course that show up at my local course and not only have never played there but havent played golf for long and they jump right to the blues. "Hey guys you might want to play the reds just to see the course before you jump to the blues" That works for the most part and they usually thank you later

[Donovan]

Because they dont know better. They think the red tees are the ladies tees. I have seen many at my local course that show up at my local course and not only have never played there but havent played golf for long and they jump right to the blues. "Hey guys you might want to play the reds just to see the course before you jump to the blues" That works for the most part and they usually thank you later

I concur. This stems from ball golf prejudices more times than not.

[Dave242]

This is a different scenario, but sorta contradicts that logic. I have seen courses where new longer tees have been added with a narrow or harder angle chute off the tee. For some reason basically everyone sticks with the original tees.

I am assuming it is force of habit, but one would think that would diminish after a few years (but it hasn't). I've always been puzzled since I believe the macho dynamic mentioned above is pretty prevalent.

[zud00]

I guess if they play from the longs, they think they look better than what they really are.
Whenever I go to a new course, I will usually play the longs unless they are ridiculous (never happened yet, but I've heard the gold tees at Lemon Lake are ridiculous). If I have time at a new course, I'd try to play both long and short, but probably long first incase I don't have time to play shorts.

[scarpfish]

This is why I don't believe in a static concept of colored tees. It gives some people the impression that they have to play one or the other.

The "red" tees at one course may the skill equivalent of "blue" tees at another. Also at a lot of DG courses, the second set of tees were not part of the original design. They were retrofitted in later.

Sometimes you want those longer tees for an added challenge. Sometimes you want the shorter ones to work on your short game, or because you're short on time. I'd suggest people try alternating long and short sometime.

[Cgkdisc]

Many times it has to do with the type of tees. If the back tees are cement and the short tees are dirt and the signs are at the back tees, then expect the traffic on the back tees. If you want players to play their skill level, it helps if the tees are equivalent or the short tees even better with cement and signage there and dirt at the back until it can be afforded for both sets of tees.

[billnchristy]

These are both concrete, but the sign is at the blues. The blues are also larger but the reds are still quite adequate.

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course_pics/3345/44a5fddb.jpg

[12StonesScott]

I played the blue (middle) tees at ERP almost exclusively for a couple of years, despite the evidence from my scores that I should have been playing from the reds (short). Why? I guess the pride thing entered into it, as well as the fact that when I played with anyone else, they were almost always playing from the blues, so I did also. Aside from that, at first I also had very little idea of how my ability level compared to others -- I played regularly on object courses and occasionally with regulation targets back in the late '70s and early '80s, when the hottest discs out there were DGA Kitty Hawk drivers, then didn't play more than a round or two every few years for a couple of decades. When I started back up, I had no real clue about how well or poorly I was playing, in particular with regard to distance. Somewhere in my mind was the idea that I wasn't an absolute beginner, so I should be playing from the middle tees, not the short ones.

I'm over that now. I play the blues or blacks at ERP when I'm playing weekly singles or doubles, or when I'm with a group of better players who want to play them, but otherwise I've been sticking with the reds for the last few months.

[tamahawk]

I played ball golf for 15yrs before I discovered disc golf. I got in a bad habit of always playing the shortest (men's) tees no matter what was available. When I started playing disc golf, I made myself play from the back tees on every course. Not because I thought I was too good for the shorter tees, and I certainly didn't have the distance to justify playing the back tees, but I didn't want my bad habit to carry over to disc golf.

I think by playing the long tees, it helped me develop a solid mid-range game. I didn't have the distance, and still don't, to reach many holes from the long tees, but I have a pretty good approach. Overall, I think it was a good decision for me.

[12StonesScott]

Many times it has to do with the type of tees. If the back tees are cement and the short tees are dirt and the signs are at the back tees, then expect the traffic on the back tees. If you want players to play their skill level, it helps if the tees are equivalent or the short tees even better with cement and signage there and dirt at the back until it can be afforded for both sets of tees.

I know that's the recommendation in the PDGA course design guidelines, and I agree in principle, but there are often other considerations. For example, we had been working fruitlessly for three years to get our local parks and rec dept to agree to let us put in concrete pads to replace the crushed stone pads. The answer was always no, until we managed to secure a spot hosting an NT event for this year. The attention from the rest of the DG world, combined with the negative comments about the pads from the touring pros who'd played the event before (as a SuperTour A-Tier in 08), was enough to get us approval to put in concrete pads in time for that event. We'd have loved to do two or even all three sets of pads, but were only able to raise the funds for one set, so of course we did the longest pads, as that's what the big guys would be playing from.

We installed new tee signs at the same time, and the guys in charge of that put them in near the long pads, which made some sense at the time, but because of the way the holes flow, you can play a full round from the blues or reds and only actually see six of the signs -- on the rest of the holes, you approach the tee boxes from the front or the side and never pass the signs. These days, every time I'm out there (especially with new players or folks who haven't played this course before) that bugs me a little bit.

We're starting to work on raising funds for concrete on a second set of pads, and I'm anticipating a battle with my fellow board members about which set to do -- I'll be pushing for the reds, but I know most of them will want to do the blues (as will many of the local players, some of whom have already expressed that opinion). We have discussed consolidating the red and blue pads on some holes, since there's little difference distance-wise between them on about half the holes, but they do offer different challenges/lines on some of those, and I'd hate to lose that variety.

[billnchristy]

ERP is unique in that each tee set more or less has a different look and challenge on each hole. At alex most just add length but some of them have a different look.

ERP blue kicks my butt!!

[12StonesScott]

ERP blue kicks my butt!!

I can almost deal with the blues by now -- I average a 66 or so from the blues, vs. 60 from the reds, and my best round from the blues is 61 vs 58 from the reds. But don't even talk to me about the blacks. Just look at the scores I've posted here for my rounds from the blacks (all of which were in Monday night singles action) -- 75, 76 and 79 -- 15 to 19 strokes higher than my rounds from the reds.

[jhgonzo]

I wonder how many guys out here would call them "ladies'" or "girls'" tees if Val was shooting a round with you...

[billnchristy]

You bettah play from the blues or blacks if Val is playing a round with you.

I *know* that she could play the hardest tee and me the easiest and I would still have my ass firmly in hand by the end of the day.

and I would love every minute of it and hope my wife picked up a few things.

[WillACarpenter]

I always play blues, unless I want to play a hole entirely different...

There are a lot of reasons for this, allow me to explain. Note: I'm not encouraging this, and at the course pictured above, I would play whatever gave me the most fun

1) The first course I ever played was MCC. The tees were not well marked AT ALL at the time, and sometimes the Yellow (am tees) were the same as the whites (pro tees) and sometimes they weren't even the same path!

Hole 2 at MCC is an example, from the pro tees it's a straight tunnel shot that ends to the right a touch, after curving slightly left through the tunnel. Essential a slight S curve from a lefty or a forehand shot could ace it. The am tee is on a different path, shooting from the right with a really short tunnel, through a wide gap, ending right. A slow annyhyzer aces this hole, a straigh approach shot, and a putt birdies this one, rather easily. Even a straight shot that lofts in can be putted for birdie really easily...later on in the course the yellows become less obvious, and the discrepancies become less stark.

I decided to play from all pro tees because they felt more consistent.

Next I played Ellison: One set of tees.

Same deal with Naples (which would need longer tees, not shorter ones)

These were the only 3 courses I played for quite a while. Am tees didn't make a whole lot of a difference, everybody I played with played pro tees and they even joked about them being girl tees.

Then I branched out into the sport. I played Chili (Baker Farm) The "Pro Level" course in our area. I think it's a great course for big arms that know how to fight the wind...and kind of boring for everybody else. and I don't think that moving the tees up helps that.

Most of the elevation changes are just clumps of dirt piled up to tee off from, moving the tee up just makes it another field shot. Also a lot of the fun obstacles are close to the tee as well, here's an example: http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course_pics/3/122e98c6.jpg that mess of weeds in the bottom of the picture is a little...swamp/creek thing. The once Pro now Am tee is off to the left, on the little patch of land that crosses that little water hazard. Now you have no elevation change, and don't have to shoot over the hazard...and you've got no trees in your way AND a straight shot at the basket!

That hole becomes boring. If you look through the pictures: Baker Farm Pictures (http://www.dgcoursereview.com/gallery.php?id=3&mode=gal#) you will often see the backs of signs from the Cement Tees...those are the OLD Pro tees, now Am tees.

There's something else you will notice: No cement at the am tees. 1) I like cement tee pads. 2) How do I get better at playing that hole if I'm teeing off 30 feet closer and on the opposite side of the fairway?

Then I played Basil and Parma and Emerson and others...Basil and Emerson both have cement and signs at the Pro tees, but you have to look around really hard for the other level tees, and they have no real defined tee box. I'll take the nice cement thanks!

Then there's Parma! Parma is a FANTASTIC COURSE! But it needs signage. I've played there like 6 times and I still find myself looking for the warn grass of the pro tees from time to time. I actually play 1 or 2 am tees at this course, just for the purposes of having fun.

So what am I trying to say? I guess what I'm saying is that if I was playing for *reals* like for money or tournament or something, I'd play Am tees and try to be more competitive. But for casual rounds I want the best that hole has to offer, or at least the most.

If you really want more people to play am tees you need them to be as good as the pro tees, and they need to be just as clearly marked and have just as good of signage.

For now I'll worry about getting cement and tee signs at Parma before I worry about the Am tees getting a makeover.

\/\/

[BrotherDave]

Long tees = more disc golfing for me. Plus I usually just walk to the tee closest from the previous hole, which tends to be long tees.

[WillACarpenter]

Long tees = more disc golfing for me. Plus I usually just walk to the tee closest from the previous hole, which tends to be long tees.

...and the best marked tee, with the best teeing area...

:)

\/\/

[billnchristy]

I totally understand when the am tee neuters the course, that is no fun. This isn't really generally aimed at guys like "us" either but more at the families with beach frisbees and the TDDs that throw 100' playing the "man" tees. I guess those cases are more ignorance than anything.

[Beable]

This is one of the things that I really like about Deer Lakes. Each tee is pretty well thought out, and the different difficulties add different shots. It feels very different when I play from white vs red. I wish the rec division in the monthly events played from red, but everyone plays from white during them. So I'm compelled to practice a bit on white.

[toothyfish]

I play at Warwick Town Park in NY alot. Two concrete tees AND two baskets on each hole, all the time. So four layouts, from about 4500 to 8500. Nearly everyone I see plays the shorts. Personally I like to mix it up, to work different shots. And some of the far basket locations are really tough, up on ledges, stuffed in trees, etc. My best is a -1 short and a +8 long. My favorite is the long tees to short baskets. Really tests my driver accuracy, stretches the mids out a bit, and there are some tough annys to make. Hey, play what you want.

[prerube]

I always play the hardest tees so you guys don't call me a weiney

[REDARMY]

We have a course with red and blue tees and the reds are quite a bit easier and I score between 51 and 59 depending on pin location.

Blues add about 600-1500' and I score 65-70 on these.

We recently had a tournament where rec/women/jrs. played from reds and everyone else from blues, the course was in the longest layout.

Most of the rec. players said they had never played reds but the best score was a 51 and I scored my personal best of 57 (+1). Obviously this is the level I am at and I have no problem with that.

I also like to play the blues because they are a bit more challenging.

Now what I don't get is I have seen people that have obviously not played much and could throw maybe 100' skyward and they still insist on playing the blues like it is some kind of badge of shame to throw the reds....which are also referred to as the "ladies or kids" tees.

Now I know some courses have silly shorts that even kids don't like to throw from but basically why the hell do red level (or worse) players act like they are better than red tees?

optimism? bravado? stupidity?

[craftsman]

If it's my first time playing a course I'll usually shoot ams then pros. Most times out I'll shoot ams unless the pros offer elevation or water. For special friend rounds( holiday tradition or bragging rights rounds) we usually use the longest basket/tee option.

[RussMB]

I definitely don't have the arm for the longs! If the course I'm playing has 2 Tees, I'll play the shortest of the two. If it offers 3, I'll play the middle. I still like a challenge, plus I like to push myself to improve.