Snap vs. Hit

[jrawk]

you don't need 'proper' form to fully hit a disc, although proper form helps achieve a full hit easier.

This is correct:

Originally Posted by CBoyle

Hit = the point in which the disc is ripped from your hand. Simple as that. To have good hit you would have to control all the different variables.

Snap is the worse term in disc golf terminology to ever catch on. It's nothing more than lingo that people define in different ways. My definition of it is wrist extension. It's the same motion your wrist does when correctly snapping a whip or towel. This is the motion needed to hit a disc.

Half-hitting is when your wrist extension is out of sync and/or your throwing arm hasn't reached full extension.

Full-hitting is when the hit point occurs at maximum (or desired) arm and wrist extension.

No-hitting is when the disc doesn't pivot out of your pinch point.

[rocthecourse]

Originally Posted by BogeyNoMore

While your use of the term torque seems accurate, I didn't want anyone confusing it with Off Axis Torque (completely different), so I avoided the word "torque" altogether.

Correct me if I am wrong but they are sort of the same(at least some of the time.) OAT is bad form causing some of that torque(snap) to be off the plane(axis.)

Or to put it another way. snap=good torque, OAT=bad torque.

But then again not all OAT is the same.

I don't know, just a thought.

[rocthecourse]

Originally Posted by jrawk

you don't need 'proper' form to fully hit a disc, although proper form helps achieve a full hit easier.

Snap is the worse term in disc golf terminology to ever catch on. It's nothing more than lingo that people define in different ways. My definition of it is wrist extension. It's the same motion your wrist does when correctly snapping a whip or towel. This is the motion needed to hit a disc.

Half-hitting is when your wrist extension is out of sync and/or your throwing arm hasn't reached full extension.

Full-hitting is when the hit point occurs at maximum (or desired) arm and wrist extension.

No-hitting is when the disc doesn't pivot out of your pinch point.

I believe the OP is using "full hit" in the Blake_T way which is a little different then "the hit."

"another way to articulate the difference between the wrist in half-hitting vs. full-hitting is:

with half-hitters, the wrist extends because the inertia/momentum of the disc forces the wrist open. it's basically a half-slip.

with full-hitters, the wrist extends actively and accelerates the leading edge of the disc to a VERY high velocity in a very short period of time."- from Blake_T

http://www.discgolfreview.com/forums...hp?f=2&t=17538

My take is that by this definition proper form is a full hit and decent form is a half hit.

Just found the distances-
"Half hit discs with reference points (distances are approximate)
Roc: ~330
Buzzz: ~350
Teebird: ~410
Destroyer: ~430
Nuke: ~450

Full hit distances (approximate)
Roc: ~360+
Buzzz: ~380+
Teebird: ~440+
destroyer: ~460+
nuke: ~480+" copied from Blake_T
http://www.discgolfreview.com/forums...9220&start=450

Or maybe I just read it wrong, either way maybe the links will help someone.

[jrawk]

Originally Posted by rocthecourse

Correct me if I am wrong but they are sort of the same(at least some of the time.) OAT is bad form causing some of that torque(snap) to be off the plane(axis.)

Or to put it another way. snap=good torque, OAT=bad torque.

But then again not all OAT is the same.

I don't know, just a thought.

torque does not equate to rotation. torque is an angular force induced on the disc. Snap is not good torque. There is no good torque unless you are purposely trying to dump the disc into a roller.

OAT is not limited to disc wobble on the vertical . Oat is also on the lateral plane. Best visual example i can give you... think of a spira-graph drawing toy and drawing oblong circles. Or, think of holding your disc upside down, and putting your mini in it, then moving the disc around so the mini spins around inside. The mini's center of rotation is not the center of the disc. In fact you cannot throw a disc without a little bit of lateral oat because you are throwing the disc with one hand and one pinch point. It will begin to spin off axis, but eventually that axis will naturally move back to the gyroscopic center. The better your form is, the faster the disc will find it's gyroscopic center.

[BogeyNoMore]

Originally Posted by Dan Ensor

More air speed = more lift - correct.

More spin = more stability - two for two.

Spin probably also has to do with angular
momentum;

angular momentun is not the same as linear momentum - two different properties a disc possesses during flight.

"I'm pretty sure it effectively makes the disc significantly heavier" is where you went astray.

However, spin and the resulting force of Precession makes a spinning object want to maintain it's state of motion (think of the spinning bike wheel in science class or some museum of science and how it's harder to turn than one that isn't spinning, or how a spinning top seems to resist pushing it to change its path). Precession is a force on an object, induced by the spin. Weight is a force on a mass, induced by gravity. The fact that they are both forces means they behave similarly. In essence, spinning objects may behave as if they are heavier in some ways, but not all.

[jrawk]

Blake's definitions are correct, however if your wrist actively extends without your arm at it's apex, you're not going to full hit. somebody did a real good illustration not to long ago, i'll find that.

[kingjames1014]

So... would a heavier disc spin faster? i throw a lighter weight in distance drivers becuase i can "Snap" them better for some reason. heavier discs seem to just turn and burn for me and really light discs flip over and become rollers.

[mashnut]

Originally Posted by jrawk

torque does not equate to rotation. torque is an angular force induced on the disc. Snap is not good torque. There is no good torque unless you are purposely trying to dump the disc into a roller.

Torque is a force which produces rotation, you don't have a spinning disc without applying torque. What you want is torque applied on the plane of your throw, when you apply torque in a different plane you pull the rotation off it's axis.

[jrawk]

Here's the diagram:

[jrawk]

Originally Posted by mashnut

Torque is a force which produces rotation, you don't have a spinning disc without applying torque. What you want is torque applied on the plane of your throw, when you apply torque in a different plane you pull the rotation off it's axis.

yes torque is a force, but torque is being discussed in this thread as power/muscle. Which it shouldn't be. More power does not create more spin. Maximizing the rotational force is not achieved through power torquing.