#31  
Old 02-04-2013, 11:39 AM
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rd.bittle rd.bittle is offline
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Wow this thread is seriously helpful to no-hitters like me.
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  #32  
Old 02-04-2013, 11:51 AM
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Uncle Dougie Uncle Dougie is offline
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Originally Posted by rd.bittle View Post
Wow this thread is seriously helpful to no-hitters like me.
You think this is deep? Go over to discgolfreview and check out some those technique threads.
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  #33  
Old 02-04-2013, 12:55 PM
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BogeyNoMore BogeyNoMore is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garublador View Post
I like to describe OAT in aviation terms roll, pitch and yaw. Yaw is "on-axis" torque, and also what we call "spin." Pitch is nose angle and we rarely talk about this type of OAT, but it does exist. Roll is the "off-axis" we're normally talking about.
^Without doubt the best explanation of OAT I've ever read or heard. This really helps one visualize exactly what type of rotation you're discussing, regardless of whether you're discussing OAT, nose angle, or snap. Upon reading it a just now, I recall having read posts where Garu had described it that way quite a while ago... I just forgot.

Last edited by BogeyNoMore; 02-04-2013 at 12:57 PM.
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  #34  
Old 02-04-2013, 01:34 PM
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Dan Ensor Dan Ensor is offline
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Originally Posted by garublador View Post
That's what it is now, but my understanding is that originally "snap" was defined as the difference between those throwing Teebirds 350' and 450'. Not nearly as much was really understood about what went into "snap" so a single, generic term was used. Now there are many more terms that are more descriptive and specific and people use "snap" to mean a bunch of different things, many of which have nothing to do with the original definition.

I like to describe OAT in aviation terms roll, pitch and yaw. Yaw is "on-axis" torque, and also what we call "spin." Pitch is nose angle and we rarely talk about this type of OAT, but it does exist. Roll is the "off-axis" we're normally talking about.
I believe this is the post I was looking for. "Snap" is any part of the throw we don't know much about, but that adds distance.

And thank you! I finally know what pilots are talking about!

Would off axis pitch be an air-bounce? It's got to be incredibly difficult to apply torque off of the axis of pitch if your hand is past 12 o'clock on release, right?
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  #35  
Old 02-04-2013, 02:00 PM
garublador garublador is offline
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Originally Posted by Dan Ensor View Post
I believe this is the post I was looking for. "Snap" is any part of the throw we don't know much about, but that adds distance.
Lots of time you hear people say "snap" when they talk about any sort of wrist movement, but that's really not the case. Wrist extension at the wrong time doesn't really do any good.

Quote:
Would off axis pitch be an air-bounce? It's got to be incredibly difficult to apply torque off of the axis of pitch if your hand is past 12 o'clock on release, right?
I'm a bit confused by that question. "Off axis pitch" is a weird term because "pitch" is the axis.

Part of how you get an air bounce is by throwing with a nose up attitude on the pitch (nose angle) axis. Applying off-axis torque about the pitch axis could help give you an air bounce.
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  #36  
Old 02-04-2013, 03:00 PM
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sidewinder22 sidewinder22 is offline
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Yeah the terms Snap and Hit are used in many ways which can be confusing. Sometimes they mean the same thing and other times they are inter-related.

This is how I tend to think:

Hit is where it happens, where power meets acceleration.

Snap is another term for smash factor. Full hit, half-hit, quasi-hit are just levels of smash factor/snap. It's basically just a measure of efficiency, input vs output.
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  #37  
Old 02-04-2013, 04:06 PM
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BogeyNoMore BogeyNoMore is offline
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This very thread is why I prefer to use math and physics to analyze the game - with terms that have clear, well defined meanings and principles that are fundamentally sound. If someone hasn't taken a physics class, they can still look up words online to see how speed differs from velocity, how torque differs from force, and how acceleration is the result of force being applied to a mass.

People making up terms, and applying their own interpretation leads to taking things out of context and confusion. Confusion leads to fear. "Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.”
Do we really want to follow down this path to the Dark Side?
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  #38  
Old 02-04-2013, 04:47 PM
theeterrbear theeterrbear is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BogeyNoMore View Post
This very thread is why I prefer to use math and physics to analyze the game - with terms that have clear, well defined meanings and principles that are fundamentally sound. If someone hasn't taken a physics class, they can still look up words online to see how speed differs from velocity, how torque differs from force, and how acceleration is the result of force being applied to a mass.

People making up terms, and applying their own interpretation leads to taking things out of context and confusion. Confusion leads to fear. "Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering.
Do we really want to follow down this path to the Dark Side?
Hear, hear!

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  #39  
Old 02-04-2013, 06:16 PM
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Dan Ensor Dan Ensor is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garublador View Post
I'm a bit confused by that question. "Off axis pitch" is a weird term because "pitch" is the axis.
I knew something didn't seem right; "off pitch torque"
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  #40  
Old 02-05-2013, 09:05 AM
garublador garublador is offline
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Originally Posted by Dan Ensor View Post
I knew something didn't seem right; "off pitch torque"
I think you may be asking about torque about the pitch axis. Mechanics isn't really my strong suit so I'm not 100% sure about the correct wording, either.
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