#471  
Old 03-13-2013, 03:04 PM
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Dave242 Dave242 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
At the 2008 Minnesota Majestic Chuck, Don Ticknor and I recorded throws on a wide-open flat hole. Red, Blue and Gold are the skill levels (850, 950 and 1000 rated).
How are deducing angles from this data? A wide open field is quite different than an actual gap.

Having seen this data in use before (it is great data), I am almost certain you are measuring the landing point compared to the straight line from tee to basket. So, a line-drive shot that lands on the line versus a huge hyzer than goes 30 degrees off line but then ends up on the line are treated exactly the same. Right?
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  #472  
Old 03-13-2013, 03:48 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Originally Posted by Dave242 View Post
How are deducing angles from this data? A wide open field is quite different than an actual gap.
Maybe. It certainly seems like a player should be able to dial in the accuracy at the expense of distance. However, no one is sharing any data that would show whether players are more or less accurate when trying to hit a gap than when trying to get close to a target.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave242 View Post
Having seen this data in use before (it is great data), I am almost certain you are measuring the landing point compared to the straight line from tee to basket.
Correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave242 View Post
So, a line-drive shot that lands on the line versus a huge hyzer than goes 30 degrees off line but then ends up on the line are treated exactly the same. Right?
If a huge hyzer landed exactly on the line, it did not "go 30 degrees off line". It went right where the player wanted it to, because they player took into account the shape of the flight path and started it at the correct angle.

Presumably, that player could take into account the shape of a shorter, straighter flight path and be just as skilled at starting the disc off at the correct angle.
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  #473  
Old 03-25-2013, 10:50 AM
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grodney grodney is offline
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John, what's the story on Selah Creekside #18? From the long tee, I'm pretty sure the tee sign showed the short peninsula to be out-of-bounds, thus forcing the thrower to go for the pin, and allowing no bailout whatsoever. Is that right? At 318ft I can see that in calm to light winds. But with any more wind than that, I don't understand not offering a different choice.
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  #474  
Old 03-25-2013, 03:16 PM
johnrhouck johnrhouck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grodney View Post
John, what's the story on Selah Creekside #18? From the long tee, I'm pretty sure the tee sign showed the short peninsula to be out-of-bounds, thus forcing the thrower to go for the pin, and allowing no bailout whatsoever. Is that right? At 318ft I can see that in calm to light winds. But with any more wind than that, I don't understand not offering a different choice.
Rodney, you're right -- not offering a different option would be very strange. Several players at Am World Doubles had the same question, and I'm really scratching my head. There's only one small OB area, and the entire left side of the fairway is available to you. There are acres and acres of places to lay up. Most people who aren't going for the pin throw to the short tee. From there it's about 200' to the pin, and about only 180' to clear the water. If that's too scary for you, which can certainly happen when it gets really windy, then you can play all the way around the pond.

Throwing to the short tee seems like such an obvious option -- maybe you or someone else can help me understand why it's not clear. I can send a picture of the tee sign when I get home in a few days, but the Overview/scorecard map shows it clearly -- it even shows the layup as an option:

http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course...0/5506af72.jpg
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  #475  
Old 03-25-2013, 07:01 PM
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grodney grodney is offline
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Yeah, guess I'd need to see the tee sign again. I only glanced at it myself, and saw the short peninsula OB. I assumed the way everyone was talking that EVERYTHING other than the basket peninsula was OB.
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  #476  
Old 03-29-2013, 10:09 AM
johnrhouck johnrhouck is offline
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Originally Posted by grodney View Post
Yeah, guess I'd need to see the tee sign again. I only glanced at it myself, and saw the short peninsula OB. I assumed the way everyone was talking that EVERYTHING other than the basket peninsula was OB.
Rodney, here's the tee sign for Creekside #18, blue tee.

As with all the signs, we made the "fairway" a lighter green. The OB areas on the near peninsula and behind the basket are clearly labeled, no?

Lots of room to lay up, and even to play around the pond, though that's not all shown.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Creekside 18.jpg (66.4 KB, 92 views)
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Old 03-29-2013, 10:59 AM
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Dave242 Dave242 is offline
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Is that OB peninsula philosophically any different than the widely hated Mando marker?


Last edited by Dave242; 03-29-2013 at 11:01 AM.
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  #478  
Old 03-29-2013, 11:22 AM
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grodney grodney is offline
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Hmmmm, guess we just read the sign wrong. I don't think anybody considered laying up left -- over by the short tee. I blame the Shiner.

p.s. I don't understand why the short peninsula is OB.
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  #479  
Old 03-29-2013, 11:41 AM
Cgkdisc Cgkdisc is offline
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I think it might be interesting to have part of the peninsula inbounds as an optional tricky landing area. Perhaps have the 40'-50' tip of the peninsula either IB or OB.
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  #480  
Old 03-29-2013, 11:56 AM
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grodney grodney is offline
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My point: If you can't go for the main green from the tee (due to skill or conditions), then laying up to the short peninsula still isn't a gimme 3. So I don't understand why it's OB.

Yes, in good conditions for a good player, the layup would be an easy 3. But in that case, they're going for the basket off the tee anyway.
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