#1  
Old 07-25-2010, 11:40 PM
Kent18's Avatar
Kent18 Kent18 is offline
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Location: Raleigh, NC area
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Disc Bag suggestions!

I have been playing a year now and for the most part I have become more accurate but my distances haven't increased. I throw 270-310 feet consistantly. I have been using the discs below and most don't look beat in but I have been turning them over lately or having them fly very unstable. I think its because I am learning how to snap them harder which I thought would lead to more distance but instead having them travel during flight gradually more to the right (Im a RHBT). What discs should I switch too or any suggestions.

Innova Aviar DX 175g
Condition: Good
Notes: My main putter
Innova Birdie DX 172g
Condition: Good
Notes: Rarely used putter
Innova Dart R-Pro 172g
Condition: Excellent
Notes: use it in a stiff wind and for falling putts
Innova Dragon DX 150g
Condition: Excellent
Notes: Only use it for medium drives over water
Innova Leopard Pro 175g
Condition: Average
Notes: It now is really understable and I have to really hold back when I throw it (Throw it about 280 feet)
Innova Mako Star 174g
Condition: Excellent
Notes: Right now this is the most unpredictable disc for me in my bag, hardly ever throw it.
Innova Orc Champion 169g
Condition: Good
Notes: I love throwing this for long hyzer shots but it seems to drift more an more as time goes along to the understable route for RHBT (Throw it 290-310)
Innova Panther Champion 171g
Condition: Excellent
Notes: I love this disc and throw it like I am taking a long putt and cuts through the wind great for that extra glide
Innova Roadrunner Champion 169g
Condition: Good
Notes: Since I have no forehand shot I throw this and release it with some anhyzer for those long doglegs right
Innova Shark DX 167g
Condition: Good
Notes: I like this disc when I am throwing slighly downhill with a need for a drop off at the end with some hyzer
Innova Sidewinder Champion 168g
Condition: Good
Notes: Was for the longest time my number one driver but now goes way too understable (throw it 290-310 feet)
Innova SL Star 172g
Condition: Excellent
Notes: If I throw this just right on a downhill drive I can get a nice s curve for max D (for situation described above 320 plus)
Innova TL Star 172g
Condtion: Excellent
Notes: My favorite fairway driver (should probably throw it more than I do, can easily throw it straight about 290 feet)
Innova Viking Champion 173g
Condition: Excellent
Notes: I throw this on 75% of my drives off the pad. It just stays straight almost all the way through the flight for me. I don't know why sometimes I have other drivers in my bag. This disc is so controllable for me but recently I have been turning this over a touch, thinking I should get a new heavier one. I throw this 280-310 feet
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  #2  
Old 07-26-2010, 07:44 PM
djjeremiahj djjeremiahj is offline
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Quote:
I have been playing a year now and for the most part I have become more accurate but my distances haven't increased. I throw 270-310 feet consistantly. I have been using the discs below and most don't look beat in but I have been turning them over lately or having them fly very unstable. I think its because I am learning how to snap them harder which I thought would lead to more distance but instead having them travel during flight gradually more to the right (Im a RHBT).
Snap helps keep the disc straight your issue is probably due to you trying too hard and forcing an Off Axis Throw / Torque issue or improper wrist angles.


Max Distance Drivers:
<None>
Maybe a 168 Katana?
172 Wraith?

All Purpose Drivers / Fairway Drivers:
Innova Orc Champion 169g - Move up to the wraith....
Innova SL Star 172g - Calm Day / Tailwind rider.
Innova Sidewinder Champion 168g from your words, it sounds like this disc needs to be replaced (or you need to go into a field and relearn it)
Innova Roadrunner Champion 169g - Turnover Driver (why so light?)
Innova Viking Champion 173g - Keep as a "placement" disc. Precision over distance.
<space added to denote speed drop>
Innova TL Star 172g - Tunnel Driver, straight driver.
Innova Leopard Pro 175g Redundant with Roadrunner and TL.
Add 171 Tbird or Eagle

Short Fairway / Long Approach

Innova Panther Champion 171g - do you really need a short range turnover disc when you have a Mako and/or Shark?
Innova Mako Star 174g - With the extra weight, isnt this basically a TL duplicate?
Innova Shark DX 167g - Lighter means more flip... Get a 169 Roc and put this one (and probably the mako) away for a season.
Innova Dragon DX 150g - no comment.... current use is adequate

Putter / Short Approach
Innova Dart R-Pro 172g - Try to expand and use this as a short approach/long putt "attack the basket" disc (35'-75').
Innova Birdie DX 172g - It's redundant... Buy a 170-172g Rhyno (champ).
* You might try to use this as a Putter Driver Disc. Good disc to learn on....
Innova Aviar DX 175g - Putter, Short Range Putter

What i see... be careful with dropping weight... dropping too much can cause the "flip" issues you are having. (you are used to throwing heavier discs, so the same throw is too much power).

Start "discing up".... obviously you've learned the throw and form, start looking for other faster options instead of trying to overpower your current slower discs. (Wraith, Katana)

No Overstable. You either play in a windless cave and/or have no forehand.
* Honorable mention can go to the Orc depending on how you throw it.

Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.Get a Roc.
* It will replace both the shark and mako.

Get a Tbird or Eagle.Get a Tbird or Eagle.Get a Tbird or Eagle.Get a Tbird or Eagle.
*either will open up your long fairway / medium drive range (250-300'). the precision of these discs will help immensely and you (should) naturally fall into throwing it they will feel,throw and fly similar to your TL.

I really see a short approach/long putt gap. Try the Dart for a minute. Then you might like the Ion or find another replacement.

Learn the Putt Driver.

I'm curious about the forehand (lack thereof) issue. Maybe a Firebird? (or *slower* Gator or Rhyno)

overall, you seem like a person who needs to focus on refining the discs they have (via practice, replacement, or omission) and learn next level shots - hyzer flip, roller, forehand, short range flick, overhand, etc... it seems like "the right" driver to extend your range, plugging in a few missing pieces (roc, Tbird,etc), expand your short game (via putter drives, Dart & Roc) and practice you should hit the next plateau and drop a few points....

Last edited by djjeremiahj; 07-26-2010 at 07:48 PM.
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  #3  
Old 07-26-2010, 07:59 PM
SpyderPride SpyderPride is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 236
Sounds like a major case of OAT, but don't worry: most DGers trying to improve their game and gain distance will go through at least one serious bout of the nasty disc torque. I am still working my way out, but I have been fairly successful of late... my most understable discs are now my straight drivers, but I can still induce some intentional torque to get a nice turn out of them.

My recommendation is to go into OAT-killing mode and force yourself to use your flippiest plastic until you work your way out of it. It forces you to be smooth and under control, and you will gain straight distance once you start throwing clean. So, that would be Sidewinder, Leopard, Shark, and Aviar. 4 discs you can hold in your hand and leave the rest of the bag at home. Try to push the Aviar out beyond 220' and Shark out beyond 250' in driving distance (hint: use more height, but keep the nose down).

Good luck!

Last edited by SpyderPride; 07-26-2010 at 08:01 PM.
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  #4  
Old 07-26-2010, 08:04 PM
SpyderPride SpyderPride is offline
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Oh yeah, don't buy heavier or more overstable discs... it will just amplify your OAT. You'll get the quick reward of straighter shots but your form will suffer.
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  #5  
Old 07-26-2010, 08:25 PM
Kent18's Avatar
Kent18 Kent18 is offline
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Thanks guys, I really appreciate the time you took to give feedback. I think you guys were right on. I am going to follow a couple of your recommendations for sure. What is hard is my friends and I are now going out twice sometimes three times a week to play disc golf and we are all former college athletes of another sport and we are so competitive that we don't want to lose to each other every time we play so we do what we are great at versus experimenting with the other shots of this game (i.e. forehand flick, thumber, and so on). Thanks again
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  #6  
Old 07-26-2010, 08:36 PM
Kent18's Avatar
Kent18 Kent18 is offline
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I'm embarrassed to ask this questions; but when I hear thumber, flex shot, flip shots, spike hyzers, spike anhyzers I am not sure I know what that all means? I mean I know what a hyzer and anhyzer shot is but thats it. I feel like the different disc companies and youtube videos I have seen all call things different. Do you guys know of a link that has the best exhaustive and most descriptive of terms for certian shots?
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  #7  
Old 07-26-2010, 10:04 PM
SpyderPride SpyderPride is offline
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Not that I'm familiar with, but if you want to ask questions here we can answer them. Don't ever feel embarrassed to ask questions... how else do you learn?

Thumber: overhand shot with only your thumb under the flight plate resting on the rim.
Flex shot: typically a high anhyzer with an overstable disc that "flexes" to fade forward, basically a high exaggerated s-curve.
Flip shot: not exactly sure on the terminology but you may mean "hyzer flip", which is exactly how it sounds, a shot that starts as an initial hyzer and flips flat or goes beyond that to a turnover. The other possibility is "flick shot" or just "flick" which is basically forehand/sidearm.
Spike Hyzer: a high hyzer that never flattens but simply dives straight into the ground. These can be very accurate if you have room for them.
Spike Anhyzer: probably the opposite of the spike hyzer, but I haven't heard this one before. Probably can be described as a turn-and-burn (hard turnover).
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  #8  
Old 07-26-2010, 10:43 PM
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BrotherDave BrotherDave is offline
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[strike][/strike]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kent18 View Post
Innova Aviar DX 175g
Innova Birdie DX 172g
Innova Dart R-Pro 172g
Innova Dragon DX 150g
Innova Leopard Pro 175g
Innova Mako Star 174g
Innova Orc Champion 169g
Innova Panther Champion 171g
Innova Roadrunner Champion 169g
Innova Shark DX 167g
Innova Sidewinder Champion 168g
Innova SL Star 172g
Innova TL Star 172g
Innova Viking Champion 173g
Pick one, these overlap too much. Actually, in the long run you'd be better off getting a Star or Champ or new Pro Leopard and getting it to do these shots.

I crossed out everything that overlapped, was too fast for now, or that you are clearly not throwing.

My biggest advice would be for you to learn to throw some controlled hyzers with your discs, especially the ones you think are too flippy. Rough form, what we call Off Axis Torque or OAT, can make discs seem much flippier than they really are. It sounds to me like you are rolling your wrist over which creates torque, take note if your palm is facing the sky next time you play after a big throw, if it is then that's a big no-no. Your palm should stay on the same plane as your shoulders, i.e. if you're throwing a disc perfectly flat then your palm should stay parallel with the ground.

You also may want a heavier Shark, or to go the conventional stable midrange route with a Roc, Buzzz, Core, Cro, Wasp, Comet, QMS, etc.

Spyderpride is on point with the term definitions. Good job Spidey And yeah, an anhyzer spike would just turn into a roller.
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