#31  
Old 04-23-2014, 09:00 AM
garublador garublador is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyShine View Post
I think the trouble here is that some folks are assuming a fast, high-speed drive off of the tee, and that was not part of my original question.
What people are saying and what you are refusing to understand is that's the only time it's worth telling people to try to get the nose down. On slower shots it's not necessary. It's also not necessary on some higher speed shots like hyzers and intentional stall shots. Slower discs tolerate nose up flights much better than faster discs, too so it's not as important with them.

It's also worth pointing out that the nose angle can, and will change during the flight. A slightly nose up throw can turn into a very nose up throw pretty quickly. The forces on the disc will push the nose up more and more. A slightly nose down throw won't do that because the initial forces will keep the nose down. So yeah, a few degrees either way (and the same applies to hyzer and anhyzer) can make a huge difference, especially with faster discs. Again, with slower discs this won't happen or matter nearly as much.

All of your questions have been answered, you just refuse to believe what anyone else is saying. If you're flabbergasted, it's not with the responses you're getting, it's with how you're reacting to them.
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  #32  
Old 04-23-2014, 09:17 AM
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BirdieMachine BirdieMachine is offline
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Problem is 99.9% of noobs with angle issues throw too far nose up. Rarely do people throw too far nose down. It's far better to throw nose down a couple degrees then nose up. You can call it flat, whatever. The disc angle will usually always change some during flight anyways. Rising the nose as it slows and fades.
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  #33  
Old 04-23-2014, 10:17 AM
gradus gradus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyShine View Post
Yes, I am one of those guys that shakes his head when he hears a teenager misuse the word "literally", so maybe I'm just being anal, but if there is a legitimate throwing technique where you actually throw "nose down", I'm all ears.
At least this question was answered and MonkeyShine learned something new.



Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyShine View Post
I will often tell beginners to keep their disc flat and level like they are trying to balance food on a plate, but I will never tell them "keep the nose down".
Maybe he'll even change his teaching technique.
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  #34  
Old 04-23-2014, 11:45 AM
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Puckstopper Puckstopper is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyShine View Post
Your first post to the thread is a scathing face-blasting rant and you're accusing ME of trolling?

Blah blah blah.....

But for someone to say, "It is humanly impossible to throw with the nose perfectly flat" is simply an asinine response.
Yes, you seem like you're trolling, and I think his response was reasonable and appropriate given the way you've conducted yourself here. Notice that I said you seem like you're trolling, not that you are. If it offends you to be called a troll then maybe you should reread your responses to many people giving you a similar and consistent response. Factor in that your first post is a thread where you ask a question and then dismiss all answers because they don't agree with your opinion and see if it doesn't seem reasonable to ask you to go back under your bridge somewhere.

I don't believe that anyone said that it's humanly impossible to throw with a flat nose angle. I believe that what was said was that it is ALMOST impossible TO DO SO CONSISTENTLY. Trying to throw "nose flat" will lead to more inaccurate, unintended shots that trying to throw slightly nose down.

To put it another way, you try to throw "nose flat" on a somewhat tight hole and miss your angle. You might accidentally throw nose down and get a better drive than usual, but you're much more likely to stall out and throw a newb-hyzer that either hits a branch and gets knocked down 50' down the fairway or ends up way left in some trees. On the same hole I try to throw nose down and miss my angle. I may burn one into the ground 100-150' down the fairway, or I may miss high and throw "nose level" and just be a little shorter and further left than I'd originally aimed. My catastrophic miss is still better than yours (All distances are approximated from my own transition and experiences learning to throw nose down).

Now, you can either accept the commonly accepted terminology and assimilate into the community, or you can continually fight this battle and be viewed as a troll. Your choice.
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  #35  
Old 04-23-2014, 01:29 PM
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dreadlock86 dreadlock86 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyShine View Post
Your first post to the thread is a scathing face-blasting rant and you're accusing ME of trolling?

I don't think anyone is justified here claiming that a 0.000000000 degree of tilt with a plus or minus 0 tolerance nose angle is necessary to call it "flat". That's what several people have claimed so far, a level of scrutiny which they would not apply to any other aspect of disc golf.

My original question was whether or not there was such thing as throwing a disc nose flat. Some answered that you want to throw nose down to maximize distance, which is a fair answer if not slightly beside the point. But for someone to say, "It is humanly impossible to throw with the nose perfectly flat" is simply an asinine response.

If someone said, "Try throwing your upshot with 50% power", are you going to say, "Its humanly impossible for me to throw with exactly 50% of my power is"?

if you think that was a scathing, face-blasting rant then spend some more time on the internet.

and your original question was actually 3:

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyShine View Post
Is there no such thing as "Nose just right, neither up nor down?"

"Nose up" is a shot that tail-skates, "nose down" is a cut-roller, and "nose level/flat" is an ideal nose angle that allows a disc to glide forward. Am I wrong?

My question is this: when an advanced player who actually knows what they are talking about says, "keep the nose down", do they actually mean to say, "keep the nose from going up", or are they describing some variation of distance technique whereby the disc is launched skyward but the nose is down somehow, like the opposite of an air-bounce if that is possible?

people answered all three but since you didn't get the response you wanted to the second and third, you just argued the point on the first question.

yes, you are technically correct: you can throw a flat-nosed throw. the point is that this is typically not the ideal throw, regardless of distance.

you can compare it to the hyzer/flat/anny release angles. sure you can throw flat but how often is that the ideal? most of the time any shot that is not an anny will be thrown on some kind of hyzer, slight or sharp, because it is easier to control and it minimizes the opportunity to make a mistake and/or torque the disc. trying to throw most of your shots flat will probably result in more unintended turn overs than if you use a slight hyzer as your baseline angle.


so to clearly answer all three questions:
-yes, there is such thing as "nose flat"
-no, this is not the ideal angle that allows a disc to glide forward
-no, they mean literally what they are saying: "keep the nose down"
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  #36  
Old 04-25-2014, 04:40 AM
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MonkeyShine MonkeyShine is offline
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Are you guys still bent out of shape about this? I thought this went to bed three days ago. At least it's obvious now who is and who isn't trolling
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  #37  
Old 04-25-2014, 08:21 AM
bhadella bhadella is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyShine View Post
Are you guys still bent out of shape about this? I thought this went to bed three days ago. At least it's obvious now who is and who isn't trolling
ummm....thread has been dead for 48 hours. :troll:
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