#381  
Old 08-07-2011, 09:55 PM
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Too late to edit and I have a mini rant:

So my biggest problem with Innova and even with discraft, albeit not as bad, is the inconsistencies and changing molds, plastic, etc. Why are the new companies not learning from these mistakes and capitalizing on it. Why come out with a disc that everyone seems to like and then change it? Just doesn't make sense to me. I guess you probably think you're making the disc better, but people love it the way it is. Not just picking on this rumor about opaques not being available either, just the changes that have taken place altogether. Why all the changes when people like them so much the way they are? People will either go to searching all over for their preferred run, or drop the disc altogether for something easier to get. Lat 64 is pretty bad about consistency as well, just sucks to get the same inconsistencies from the new companies that we are getting from the old ones.
  #382  
Old 08-07-2011, 10:11 PM
moorent moorent is offline
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Last I heard, tons of people were happy to see that the ions were getting rid of the textured frip under the rim. I'm not sure that anything has changed since that aside from new colors being introduced; are you really that upset about new colors?

You complaining that MVP is taking a chance to further refine their product because "people like them so much the way they are" is silly when you consider that the Ion itself is already a deviation from the normal putters that "people like[d] so much the way they were".

I get where you are coming from but completely disagree. Complaining about improvements stifles innovation.
  #383  
Old 08-07-2011, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moorent View Post
Last I heard, tons of people were happy to see that the ions were getting rid of the textured frip under the rim. I'm not sure that anything has changed since that aside from new colors being introduced; are you really that upset about new colors?

You complaining that MVP is taking a chance to further refine their product because "people like them so much the way they are" is silly when you consider that the Ion itself is already a deviation from the normal putters that "people like[d] so much the way they were".

I get where you are coming from but completely disagree. Complaining about improvements stifles innovation.
I'd like to see you say that when over half of the discs in your bag are oop and you either have to give them up or pay $25+ per disc. It really sucks. I wasn't saying they should further their efforts, but why get rid of something that everyone likes for something that no one has tried? It also wasn't just a rant about just the ions, there have been multiple reports of lat 64 discs stability being different based on color, what the hell is that? I was just looking for a disc maker to respond as to why this happens and the guys from MVP seem to be the only ones that are willing to share their info like this.
  #384  
Old 08-07-2011, 10:21 PM
moorent moorent is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roadtripstuff View Post
there have been multiple reports of lat 64 discs stability being different based on color, what the hell is that?
http://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums...ad.php?t=28157
  #385  
Old 08-07-2011, 10:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roadtripstuff View Post
I'd like to see you say that when over half of the discs in your bag are oop and you either have to give them up or pay $25+ per disc. It really sucks. I wasn't saying they should further their efforts, but why get rid of something that everyone likes for something that no one has tried? It also wasn't just a rant about just the ions, there have been multiple reports of lat 64 discs stability being different based on color, what the hell is that? I was just looking for a disc maker to respond as to why this happens and the guys from MVP seem to be the only ones that are willing to share their info like this.
Here's how it goes...
The Wizard was a good putter that Chad R.(Ion designer) liked. Why try and improve it?

The first full weight Ion runs had discs with asymmetrical overmolds, sharp flash, lettering on the bottom where it rubbed my fingers, and sandblasting that made them a bit slick...However, they were hugely successful. Why did they change then?

Do you get where I'm headed? MVP designed and produced the disc...When they started it was just kind of a dream that they thought they would give a shot, all the while planning other careers for themselves. Things just got better and better, they've sold more and more discs, and now they have more resources in terms of both $$ and knowledge. They apply what they learn and are not satisfied until things are perfect. If they do try something (like the sandblasting) that doesn't work out, they don't thumb their nose at us, but listen and actually take action to improve.

So basically if Chad says that the new plastic blend will help make things more consistent....isn't he the one who has run thousands of Ions and Vectors and tested how consistent each variety of Proton plastic is vs. the other? I for one trust Chad's judgement.

When the Ion FIRST came out almost everyone I talked to in the established DG community thought it was kind of retarded...A premium plastic putter that was funny looking in a way that DGers only associated with a Quest experiment. If someone would have described the first Ions and made a poll as to whether it would catch on or not I suspect that 90% here would have said "NO". So it was MVP alone that believed in themselves. So while it is hugely important that they remain responsive to consumers here (and they do this as well or better than anyone), it is even more important that they believe in themselves and are not discouraged by consumer doubts. Look at all the worried and negative comments here...not one of the posters has even felt or thrown a new Ion yet. So take a deep breath and have a little faith in the MVP boys...They've not let us down yet.
  #386  
Old 08-07-2011, 10:59 PM
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I must also note that I possess and have extensively used every single run of Ion to date from protos never sold to the public to the new clear colors. I could honestly use any of them exclusively for a given round and not miss a beat. They are that consistent in flight. The stability difference between the most understable and most overstable Ion I've thrown is less than a half-step(excluding the lightweight, red ringed first runs)...So no one is going to be running down old runs of Ions or giving them up unless they are seriously OCD.
  #387  
Old 08-07-2011, 11:15 PM
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This is not new plastic. We have only changed the colors used. The reason for this is to continue with our consistent Proton line and its appearance.

The only change in the Ion is removing the sharp engraved letters on the underside of the disc. This has improved the grip/feel of our disc tremendously.
  #388  
Old 08-07-2011, 11:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by discspeed View Post
I must also note that I possess and have extensively used every single run of Ion to date from protos never sold to the public to the new clear colors. I could honestly use any of them exclusively for a given round and not miss a beat. They are that consistent in flight. The stability difference between the most understable and most overstable Ion I've thrown is less than a half-step(excluding the lightweight, red ringed first runs)...So no one is going to be running down old runs of Ions or giving them up unless they are seriously OCD.
i dunno... im pretty OCD lol
  #389  
Old 08-08-2011, 12:33 AM
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My original ION (with lettering) really got me into MVP. I really bonded with it but often threw my Hydra when I go around water. I just replaced my favorite old ION with a new, non raised letter one. I like the slick better. No separation anxiety and still nailing it.

I have to use floating drivers to protect my staple of favorites. I don't like the fact that with other disc makers, there are inconsistencies disc to disc.

Not with MVP.

Pretty cool.
 

  #390  
Old 08-08-2011, 01:24 AM
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clarification desired: does the updated ion still have the sandblasted texture on the bottom? its what kept me from bagging one
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