#481  
Old 03-20-2013, 11:01 AM
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StuMagoo StuMagoo is offline
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And #4 Lakeside truly is an awesome hole. It's almost as fun as #7. Rightys will have an advantage on hole 4. 3 good hyzers and your there for birdie. (2 if you can throw 400+) Leftys will have the advantage on hole 7, 3 good hyzers, bam. Easier said than some though on those risky water shots. I'm so glad my partner is a lefty!
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  #482  
Old 03-22-2013, 11:06 PM
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Pwingles Pwingles is offline
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Yeah, wow. 4,7 at lakeside are great holes, very difficult.
The input for 14 earlier was very helpful also.

Creekside is great as well. #16 long is fun. 18 long is dangerous, saw a lot of people throw ob today.
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  #483  
Old 03-25-2013, 10:44 AM
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grodney grodney is offline
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Okay, so like I said, Lakeside is an easy 5 and I gave it that.

Creekside is more questionable, but in the end it's a 5. It is certainly not perfect, but it is "Best of the Best" in my book, and is in the very top tier of the ~120 courses I've played.
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  #484  
Old 03-25-2013, 10:55 AM
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jsc430 jsc430 is offline
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^ nice review man

Although I wold argue that creekside 1 is not a field shot. The others 2,7,8 I 100% agree with.
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  #485  
Old 03-26-2013, 10:12 AM
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Pwingles Pwingles is offline
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I gave both a 4.5, i have a hard time giving any course a 5. Whether youre basing the rating off of the entire experience or solely the course, im really hardpressed to give any course the perfect score.

Being as objective as i could be and not letting the weather or anything influence my decision making process, these are both 4.8 to me. If there is a way to score it that way in a review tell me and ill try and change it.

Outside of lakeside 3 and creekside 11 i thought all the holes offered a challenge and had to be played methodically. To me these were filler holes, and thats fine. Sometimes theyre unavoidable and i didnt expect every hole to be the best hole id ever played.

I really really liked lakeside 2,4,7, and 18. On Creek i really liked 6, 16, 17, and 18. Nothing wrong with the most of the others I just especially enjoyed those.

Holes i hated, lakeside 14, creekside 3, 10, 14, 15. I was really bummed in these holes considering some of the careful thought that went into the others.

I had a blast playing there for 4 days even though the weather sucked. John Houck was very nice to talk to, and everyone there volunteer wise were super hospitable. Its a great piece of land with awesome amenities and 2 fantastic courses. Its worth the drive for me to come back a couple times a year for sure.

Last edited by Pwingles; 03-26-2013 at 10:15 AM.
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  #486  
Old 03-26-2013, 11:14 AM
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grodney grodney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pwingles View Post
I gave both a 4.5, i have a hard time giving any course a 5. Whether youre basing the rating off of the entire experience or solely the course, im really hardpressed to give any course the perfect score.

Being as objective as i could be and not letting the weather or anything influence my decision making process, these are both 4.8 to me. If there is a way to score it that way in a review tell me and ill try and change it.
Just depends on your definition of what a 5.0 is. Is your definition "perfect"? Or is it the "best course(s)", i.e. the very top tier of courses?

4 years ago when I reviewed the best course I'd ever played (out of 110), I gave it a 4.5 because it wasn't perfect. A couple years later, I modified my opinion of what a 5.0 is, and I changed it to a 5.0.
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  #487  
Old 03-26-2013, 12:01 PM
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grodney grodney is offline
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Originally Posted by Pwingles View Post
Outside of lakeside 3 and creekside 11 i thought all the holes offered a challenge and had to be played methodically. To me these were filler holes, and thats fine. Sometimes theyre unavoidable and i didnt expect every hole to be the best hole id ever played.
Yes, Lake 3 is pretty weak. Creek 11 takes a little more skill I think, but still fairly weak.

Quote:
Holes i hated, lakeside 14, creekside 3, 10, 14, 15. I was really bummed in these holes considering some of the careful thought that went into the others.
Lake 14 is well-documented, so I won't repeat.

Creek 3 - Love it. After playing it you see that you can throw an aggressive drive long and through the tree line without the water being very close. But a less aggressive play still has a very long landing area. Too short and the giant bush is in the way, too long and the tree line gets too think -- but there's a very generous space between those. And no matter where you are in that landing area, you have ample gaps to shape a shot through the tree line, cutting the water, and heading to the pin.

Creek 10 - I understand the concept, but two problems for me. 1) The right (safe) route is still tight enough that I might as well just play the left (risky) route. But that might be a "me" problem. 2) Even if the left gap is well-executed, I didn't see a clear hero route to the pin for a shot at eagle 3. Three of my friends playing best-shot triples made eagle, but they had the luxury of throwing chuck-and-hope from the left-side landing through the crap to the basket. I personally would prefer the right route a little wider and the left 2nd shot a little more clear.

Creek 14 - Yeah. Houck listed this as one of the strongest holes earlier in this thread. I apparently need to play it more. Didn't hate it. Nothing overly wrong it with it. Just nothing special for me.

Creek 15 - Hmm, disagree. I think it's fine. Plenty of different shot options. Watched my brother ace it on the straight (actually left-to-right) line with Discraft's cheap imitation of a Roc. I was happy throwing overstable burner out to the right. Other members of our group threw other shots, all of which seemed a fair test.

Just opinions, I know. I just love real golf courses so much I like talking about them.
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  #488  
Old 03-26-2013, 12:33 PM
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Dave242 Dave242 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pwingles View Post
these are both 4.8 to me. If there is a way to score it that way in a review tell me and ill try and change it.
The most helpful way to do it is to look at it as the old familiar school grading system: 5.0 is an A+.

My daughter (yes I am proud of her) came home the other day having gotten 1 question wrong on her 50 question Mandarin test. We ribbed her (in honor of her grandfather) for not being perfect and getting all of them correct......but at the end of the day her grade is an A+ which denotes "the best of the best".
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  #489  
Old 03-26-2013, 12:38 PM
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grodney grodney is offline
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And then you said "Nee hun piow liang". That's all the Mandarin I know. Actually, not even sure it's Mandarin. Ha ha, I'm so cultured.
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  #490  
Old 03-26-2013, 12:50 PM
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jsc430 jsc430 is offline
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Pwingles, a 4.8 rounds to five, no? Or are you just saying subjectively you think its 4.5 but can see it being rated higher but the reviewing population?

I agree with grodney too. I think creekside 3 and 10 are two of the best holes on the course. Both designed with many options off the tee with water in play and fair landing zones. Classic risk reward. Both are tough indeed.

IIRC, John said that he thought 10 was one of the best holes in golf. That doesn't mean its true but he's seen alot more courses than any of us(for the most part).
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