#581  
Old 03-27-2013, 05:32 PM
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giles giles is offline
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...it is a few pages back now but the referanced pictures were mine. They were from before the official opening and they were taken for our enjoyment and only uploaded as an afterthought. I have uploaded enough photos to get the "badge" and all but a few are proper photos that show the hole. I'd be fine with them being replaced with something more in line with the rest of the site.
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  #582  
Old 03-27-2013, 05:47 PM
ambroze ambroze is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnrhouck View Post
By the way, it also seems to be true that everyone who HAS met Dave considers him to be personable and humble.

Based on that fact, and based on my extensive dealings with Dave and Candy -- who have become wonderful friends of ours -- I urge everyone to resist the urge to rush to judgment based on a single e-mail. But it's a free country.

Puckstopper, as for your second area of disagreement with me, you make a good point that business e-mails are not subject to the same netiquette rules as personal e-mails. But for now I will refrain from further comment on that issue until I have more facts. As at least one alert reader noticed, we have never seen Ambroze's original e-mail to Dave, so we don't know what Dave was responding to.

Also, did anyone else notice that when Ambroze quoted Dave's e-mail, it started without capitalization:

"we are two private courses..."

That could just be a simple typo on Dave's part. It could also be that there is more to that e-mail that we have yet to see. I, for one, will not make a judgment on that e-mail without knowing more.

I'll be more than happy to provide the entire email chain since this is got blown way up and dissected from every angle. Let me clear up a few things. Why am i being called such a bad person along with puckstopper?

People who look bad after this: ambroze, puckstopper

First of all I NEVER asked for a discount and I never said anything negative about Dave? So where did all of this come from? I simply wanted to stop by and play 1 of the courses on my way through - that's all? I asked how much will that be if I wanted to only play 1 course. Is that asking or expecting a discount? NO.

Here's my email:

I found your course on DGCR and mapped out the location and it's going to be on my way to McKinney, TX where I'm going next week. It says on DGCR under the description that the unlimited green fee is $20 a day and a cart is $30. If I am able to stop and play it will be with my wife and 2 year old daughter and we will only have time to play one course. How much will that be if I wanted to only play 1 course and with a cart preferably for my wife and daughter? I would hope that would not end up costing me $50 total.

Also you guys look for me saying anything personally bad about Dave - I did say his reply was arrogant - that's my opinion.

As far as the capitalization at the beginning of Dave's reply I felt off this "Jimmy, " -

You guys really need to stop reading into things that are not there and assuming the worse. Also, for the record I sent the email off of Selah's website to: innkeeper@selahranch.com

Everyone needs to chill.
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  #583  
Old 03-27-2013, 06:44 PM
johnrhouck johnrhouck is offline
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Jimmy,

Thank you for providing the missing information. I'm going to take you at your word that there is no more to it.

I think it's pretty clear now how all this came about, but I'm still confused by some of the things you've said. I am not going to attack you, and I'm not going to defend Dave or Selah or Dave's e-mail. All I want to do is understand. You're probably a very nice guy, and you don't have to answer if you don't want to. My main interest is using this thread as a learning experience for all of us.

First of all, your position is that you never asked for or hoped for a discount. Here's what you wrote in your original e-mail:

"I would hope that would not end up costing me $50 total."

If that's not asking or hoping for a discount, what would you call it?

I can't see it as anything other than hoping for a discount, but maybe I'm missing something.

Second, I don't think anyone called you a bad person. Somebody did say that you "look bad" in this thread. Can you see the difference?

Third, you said "I took the email as patronizing and very arrogant!" Then you said you never said "anything personally bad about Dave." In your mind, what did you do: say something neutral about Dave? Say something bad about his response, but that's not saying anything bad about him?

Finally, you say that now "Everyone needs to chill." In your own words, this all started when "I was pretty upset last night over this email and... I thought I would vent a little." Can you see that this whole thing started when you decided to vent instead of chill?

If we can all "chill" and read each other's posts without preconceptions, maybe we can communicate in a way that uplifts the sport instead of bogging us all down.

Thanks,
John

Quote:
Originally Posted by ambroze View Post
I'll be more than happy to provide the entire email chain since this is got blown way up and dissected from every angle. Let me clear up a few things. Why am i being called such a bad person along with puckstopper?

People who look bad after this: ambroze, puckstopper

First of all I NEVER asked for a discount and I never said anything negative about Dave? So where did all of this come from? I simply wanted to stop by and play 1 of the courses on my way through - that's all? I asked how much will that be if I wanted to only play 1 course. Is that asking or expecting a discount? NO.

Here's my email:

I found your course on DGCR and mapped out the location and it's going to be on my way to McKinney, TX where I'm going next week. It says on DGCR under the description that the unlimited green fee is $20 a day and a cart is $30. If I am able to stop and play it will be with my wife and 2 year old daughter and we will only have time to play one course. How much will that be if I wanted to only play 1 course and with a cart preferably for my wife and daughter? I would hope that would not end up costing me $50 total.

Also you guys look for me saying anything personally bad about Dave - I did say his reply was arrogant - that's my opinion.

As far as the capitalization at the beginning of Dave's reply I felt off this "Jimmy, " -

You guys really need to stop reading into things that are not there and assuming the worse. Also, for the record I sent the email off of Selah's website to: innkeeper@selahranch.com

Everyone needs to chill.
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  #584  
Old 03-27-2013, 08:46 PM
ambroze ambroze is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnrhouck View Post
Jimmy,

Thank you for providing the missing information. I'm going to take you at your word that there is no more to it.

I think it's pretty clear now how all this came about, but I'm still confused by some of the things you've said. I am not going to attack you, and I'm not going to defend Dave or Selah or Dave's e-mail. All I want to do is understand. You're probably a very nice guy, and you don't have to answer if you don't want to. My main interest is using this thread as a learning experience for all of us.

First of all, your position is that you never asked for or hoped for a discount. Here's what you wrote in your original e-mail:

"I would hope that would not end up costing me $50 total."

If that's not asking or hoping for a discount, what would you call it?

I can't see it as anything other than hoping for a discount, but maybe I'm missing something.

Second, I don't think anyone called you a bad person. Somebody did say that you "look bad" in this thread. Can you see the difference?

Third, you said "I took the email as patronizing and very arrogant!" Then you said you never said "anything personally bad about Dave." In your mind, what did you do: say something neutral about Dave? Say something bad about his response, but that's not saying anything bad about him?

Finally, you say that now "Everyone needs to chill." In your own words, this all started when "I was pretty upset last night over this email and... I thought I would vent a little." Can you see that this whole thing started when you decided to vent instead of chill?

If we can all "chill" and read each other's posts without preconceptions, maybe we can communicate in a way that uplifts the sport instead of bogging us all down.

Thanks,
John
John. I'm tired of going on and on about this and beating my every word into the ground and having to defend myself. I'm sure something will come out of what I'm typing right now. What I've learned is you can't say anything on here without people ready to strike at you. It's that way everywhere on the Internet and I'm about done with any more posts. Chill meant stop coming back on everything I say. Lets try that okay.
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  #585  
Old 03-27-2013, 08:51 PM
johnrhouck johnrhouck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ambroze View Post
John. I'm tired of going on and on about this and beating my every word into the ground and having to defend myself. I'm sure something will come out of what I'm typing right now. What I've learned is you can't say anything on here without people ready to strike at you. It's that way everywhere on the Internet and I'm about done with any more posts. Chill meant stop coming back on everything I say. Lets try that okay.
Works for me.
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  #586  
Old 03-27-2013, 10:09 PM
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sloppydisc sloppydisc is offline
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So what's going on in here?? You kids keep it down, and be nice.

Hey, I hear there is a couple cool courses down in TX. Does anyone have any nasty design complaints so I can pick on Mr. Houck next time I see him in NC?
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  #587  
Old 03-27-2013, 10:47 PM
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jenb jenb is offline
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Yes, you can ask Mr. Houck why he insists that the 40+ women throw 200+ foot forced water carries,
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  #588  
Old 03-27-2013, 10:53 PM
johnrhouck johnrhouck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sloppydisc View Post
So what's going on in here?? You kids keep it down, and be nice.

Hey, I hear there is a couple cool courses down in TX. Does anyone have any nasty design complaints so I can pick on Mr. Houck next time I see him in NC?
Mr. Sloppy, you know I love you, but why don't you quit sitting on the sidelines and do something constructive? For example, why don't you educate my Texan friends about all the things I did wrong on the Pittsboro course. And didn't I mark some trees you need to be cutting?
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  #589  
Old 03-27-2013, 11:04 PM
77586 77586 is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sloppydisc View Post
So what's going on in here?? You kids keep it down, and be nice.

Hey, I hear there is a couple cool courses down in TX. Does anyone have any nasty design complaints so I can pick on Mr. Houck next time I see him in NC?
Yeah, you can tell him I said that this place is waaay too far from Houston.
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  #590  
Old 03-27-2013, 11:29 PM
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StuMagoo StuMagoo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jenb View Post
Yes, you can ask Mr. Houck why he insists that the 40+ women throw 200+ foot forced water carries,
I don't believe there were any 200+ forced water carries. There was always an option to lay up or go around.
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