#201  
Old 02-17-2013, 06:31 PM
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dscmn dscmn is offline
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I found this nugget on the Drone thread. This certainly clears it up. It seems to boil down to referring to stability without really referring to the word "stability" at all. Neat game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smyith View Post
Definition of stable:
a. Resistant to change of position or condition; not easily moved or disturbed
b. Not subject to sudden or extreme change or fluctuation
c. Maintaining equilibrium; self-restoring

Using that definition stable would mean to fly straight with no change like I said. Being more stable would mean it has more resistance to change in its flight. Being less stable would mean have less resistance to change in its flight. So a drone would actually be less stable than a buzzz because it has a far more likelihood of deterring from its intended flight.
now terms like overstable are not actual words. and in the case of our sport overstable means to have more resistance to flying with the spin. thus having less turn and more fade. so a drone would be more overstable than a buzzz.
don't bastardize the language cause you don't truly understand the words you are using.
This really clears it up for me, thank you. So, a drone is less stable than a buzzz. Check. This is so because "it has a far more likelihood of deterring from its intended flight." Check, err, wait. What is deterring from its intended flight? Who is preventing the flight? Is the disc preventing itself from its intended flight? Is there only one intended flight for a disc or does it know multiple flights? Are you secretly referring to stability of a disc without using the word stability? Hmm, it sure looks that way from here.

And, "a drone would be more overstable than a buzzz," because overstable isn't actually a word. Or, it has "more resistance to flying with the spin." That's certainly clear, and it most certainly is not referring to stability at all. Wink, wink. Got it. This way is so much better.
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Last edited by dscmn; 02-17-2013 at 06:33 PM. Reason: 3 z's
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  #202  
Old 02-17-2013, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave242 View Post
Thinking about it a little more, maybe it isn't the positive/negative thing since looking at the pH scale (0-14) it is fraught with the same complexities/issues as the -3 to +3 scale.

Replace acidity with understability and alkalinity with overstability (and the fluid names with disc names) and see how this fits for size:

A more apt comparison would be to change the name of the scale from pH to say, acidity scale. Now, change the term neutral to acidic and increasing acidity to overacidity and increasing alkaline to underacidity and you start to see the confusion that is the disc golf stability scale.

“Boy, this vinegar seems to be more acidic than usual.”
“Don’t you mean, ‘more overacidic,’ because that vinegar is actually not acidic at all.”
“Well, okay, doesn’t OVER acidic imply more acidic?”
“No, it’s not actually a word at all. Here, drink this Kool-Aid and just do what you’re told. It’s more overacidic, okay?”
“Well, I’ve had battery acid and this isn’t that acidic at all?”
“Overacidic.”
“What? Are you trying to be funny?”
“It’s overacidic and it’s not a word but you still have to use it. Drink up.”

Overstable and understable work perfectly, there needs to be a term for neutral that allows for disc golfers to use the terms “more stable and less stable” as god and the English intended.
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  #203  
Old 02-17-2013, 09:45 PM
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Huk Finn Huk Finn is offline
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My friends horses at his ranch stay in a stable. When I was a kid I slept on the roof there (over stable). He buried a treasure chest beneath it (understable). He is buying 3 more horses. (He will need more stable).
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  #204  
Old 02-17-2013, 09:58 PM
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UnitedPuppySlayer UnitedPuppySlayer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huk Finn View Post
My friends horses at his ranch stay in a stable. When I was a kid I slept on the roof there (over stable). He buried a treasure chest beneath it (understable). He is buying 3 more horses. (He will need more stable).
Welp, this is the second best thing I've read tonight!
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  #205  
Old 02-17-2013, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huk Finn View Post
My friends horses at his ranch stay in a stable. When I was a kid I slept on the roof there (over stable). He buried a treasure chest beneath it (understable). He is buying 3 more horses. (He will need more stable).
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  #206  
Old 02-17-2013, 10:02 PM
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The added benefit to a new term for neutral or straight would be a more precise usage of the much beloved “more overstable.” As it is now, if I’m going to go along with the stability cult, I’d say that a Firebird is more overstable than a Roadrunner. That’s true, but what isn’t? What is also true is that a Roadrunner isn’t technically overstable at all. Now I know this is “solved” by saying that a Roadrunner has negative overstability, but that certainly isn’t intuitive to most and the comparison that is left is almost meaningless. It doesn’t tell me much at all about the two discs.

Overstable can be used more precisely to compare only those discs that fall into the overstability category. When someone says that a Drone is more overstable than a Hornet, and the listener doesn’t know a lick about the Hornet, he would at least know that both discs are in the overstability category, because the term is being used precisely, and he could eliminate the rest of the scale in his head--something that is not possible if overstability is used as the term to compare all discs in all categories. It’s too blunt an instrument for a scale.

Allowing the use of more stable and less stable gives more meaning to the other three terms, overstable, understable and zerostable, or straight or neutral. I like neutral personally. Someone can come out with the Newt.
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  #207  
Old 02-17-2013, 10:04 PM
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UnitedPuppySlayer UnitedPuppySlayer is offline
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Regardless of what is said in here, people are still going to say more stable in place of more overstable. There is no way this will ever change.
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  #208  
Old 02-17-2013, 10:11 PM
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5QU166Y 5QU166Y is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dscmn View Post
The added benefit to a new term for neutral or straight would be a more precise usage of the much beloved “more overstable.” As it is now, if I’m going to go along with the stability cult, I’d say that a Firebird is more overstable than a Roadrunner. That’s true, but what isn’t? What is also true is that a Roadrunner isn’t technically overstable at all. Now I know this is “solved” by saying that a Roadrunner has negative overstability, but that certainly isn’t intuitive to most and the comparison that is left is almost meaningless. It doesn’t tell me much at all about the two discs.
I agree with your post, but I have to ask, why would anyone compare those two discs to each other anyway? Saying a Firebird is more overstable than a Roadrunner sounds a little funny, but odds are, you won't be making comparisons like that in the real world. You would say something like "Firebirds are more overstable than Orcs."

I think the term "more overstable" is very clear, and it only sounds awkward when making a comparison which is awkward to begin with.
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  #209  
Old 02-17-2013, 10:15 PM
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BigSky BigSky is offline
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^^^Comparing any discs to each other is appropriate, especially when explaining disc flight to beginners
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  #210  
Old 02-17-2013, 10:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSky View Post
^^^Comparing any discs to each other is appropriate, especially when explaining disc flight to beginners
Dang it. The other part of my post was deleted. I also said that if I were to compare a Firebird and Roadrunner, I wouldn't say "more overstable" or "more understable." I would say something along the lines of, "the Firebird is overstable, and the Roadrunner is understable."
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