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  #201  
Old 04-10-2013, 11:28 AM
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DavidSauls DavidSauls is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart View Post
Ams...like all other sports....should be ALL trophy only. If you want to play for more than trophys than there is a place to do that...in the PRO divisions...
Would you feel the same if we changed the names of our classifications, but left everything else the same?
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  #202  
Old 04-10-2013, 11:53 AM
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Future_Primitive Future_Primitive is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart View Post
Ams...like all other sports....should be ALL trophy only. If you want to play for more than trophys than there is a place to do that...in the PRO divisions...
So if I call myself the President of the United States then that makes me the President of the United States by your logic right? I can put it on a business card to make it official, so therefore everyone must respect my new title and treat me like the President of the United States. Pssst... There are no true Amateurs in Disc Golf, just divisions named "Amateur" in name only.

Also by your logic, then every tournament I enter as an Am should be 100% free entry. I mean no college amateur football player has to pay to play on Saturdays. The guys on the Louisville Cardinals did not have to pay to enter the NCAA March Madness tournament, yet they received their trophy. The U-Conn girls hoop team didnt pay either for their tourney entry and trophy.

Also, since I am an Amateur I deserve a sponsorship/scholarship from someone like Dynamic Discs, just like all other sports. Those guys and gals who play college amateur sports receive a hefty amount of free tuition money to attend said school. So by your faulty logic, I as an amateur deserve to be compensated for attending your event. Since you are paying for me to play in your event I then accept that I am only eligible to receive a trophy for winning. Sounds fair to me.

Do you see how stupid it sounds when trying to use the true meaning of the word "Amateur" and apply it to the participants in a Disc Golf Tourney?

I am all for restructuring the payouts and renaming the divisions to something more related to what we are actually doing. I dont think half the field should be paid out in the non-Open divisions. But I also think anyone trying to use the word "amateur" in the argument is extremely naive and is using faulty logic. If you want it to change, then deal with what needs to be changed rather than cling to improper division names taken at face value.

We all pay to play in tourneys, Open players, Advanced, Intermediate, Rec and Novice. The majority belong to the PDGA, for those not in the know the P stands for Professional. Which I think is another part of the problem. To bad they didnt follow the PGA and USGA model, so actual Pros would have to earn their PDGA status through play. This would separate the real Pros from the people who just play in the Open division to play for money.

Playing in Open doesn't make you a professional player, just like playing in the Amateur division doesn't make you an Amateur in the true definition of the word.
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  #203  
Old 04-10-2013, 12:07 PM
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tbird888 tbird888 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenThrower View Post
So if I call myself the President of the United States then that makes me the President of the United States by your logic right? I can put it on a business card to make it official, so therefore everyone must respect my new title and treat me like the President of the United States. Pssst... There are no true Amateurs in Disc Golf, just divisions named "Amateur" in name only.
When I competed, I had another job and competed in tournaments for fun. That makes me an amateur. Consider the definition.

Quote:
am·a·teur (m-tūr, -tr, -chr, -chr, -tyr)
n.
1. A person who engages in an art, science, study, or athletic activity as a pastime rather than as a profession.
2. Sports An athlete who has never accepted money, or who accepts money under restrictions specified by a regulatory body, for participating in a competition.
Plastic is not money. Neither is a trophy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenThrower View Post
Also by your logic, then every tournament I enter as an Am should be 100% free entry. I mean no college amateur football player has to pay to play on Saturdays. The guys on the Louisville Cardinals did not have to pay to enter the NCAA March Madness tournament, yet they received their trophy. The U-Conn girls hoop team didnt pay either for their tourney entry and trophy.

Also, since I am an Amateur I deserve a sponsorship/scholarship from someone like Dynamic Discs, just like all other sports. Those guys and gals who play college amateur sports receive a hefty amount of free tuition money to attend said school. So by your faulty logic, I as an amateur deserve to be compensated for attending your event. Since you are paying for me to play in your event I then accept that I am only eligible to receive a trophy for winning. Sounds fair to me.

Do you see how stupid it sounds when trying to use the true meaning of the word "Amateur" and apply it to the participants in a Disc Golf Tourney?
I pay to play in AMATEUR softball, soccer, and broomball leagues. I don't even play for a trophy (or gloves, balls, shoes, pads, etc.). Not even a t-shirt. You're severely limited in your argument that college sports are the only form of amateur competition.
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  #204  
Old 04-10-2013, 12:28 PM
wake911 wake911 is offline
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Wow, did Golden Thrower stretch his analogies to a bit extreme.

I pay to compete in Water ski tournaments with a crappy medal as the prize. I've competed for a plaque, for a trophy. Have to pay EVREY time. Same with Table Tennis, euchre, horseshoes, corn hole, softball, flag football I've competed in.

I think there needs to be a level above pro, called Touring Pro, that has to be qualified into to be a part of. Oh wait, there is a list of all current touring pros that required qualifying for based on merit.....hmmm, maybe you can't play in the touring pro division at M and NT's unless you are on that list? (like the PGA has)

Then there are "Local Pros", or people who play for money. (discs are money, vouchers are money, if you can turn it into money it's money and should be considered not amateur)

Then Amateurs who play for trophy only and the experience of competing. If you don't feel it is worth paying for the tournament without some sort of payout, then play pro, or don't play.

I don't understand how this is tough to get. This is the only sport I've been associated with in all my years of playing sports that gives cash valued prizes for amateur competition.
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  #205  
Old 04-10-2013, 12:35 PM
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tbird888 tbird888 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wake911 View Post
Then there are "Local Pros", or people who play for money. (discs are money, vouchers are money, if you can turn it into money it's money and should be considered not amateur)
I would disagree with this. I can't buy a loaf of bread and a gallon of milk with a DX Roc. It's a good, not money. Just because something has value doesn't mean it's money (well, a DX Roc in the right stage of wear can be money! ).
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  #206  
Old 04-10-2013, 12:56 PM
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DavidSauls DavidSauls is offline
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More than half the "Pros" at my tournament this weekend will leave with nothing. Two thirds will leave with no more than their entry.

If they're not getting paid to play, can they be said to be "playing PRO"?
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  #207  
Old 04-10-2013, 12:57 PM
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DavidSauls DavidSauls is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wake911 View Post
I think there needs to be a level above pro, called Touring Pro.....
Let's just call them "Actual Pros".

As opposed to the non-professional Pros who may or may not win enough to exceed their costs, but certainly aren't making any kind of living at it.
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  #208  
Old 04-10-2013, 01:29 PM
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Rob Martin Rob Martin is offline
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round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and......
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  #209  
Old 04-15-2013, 04:17 PM
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SteezeOG SteezeOG is offline
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Originally Posted by Rob Martin View Post
round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and round and......

Just like my discs rolling away and the circles I was getting around my numbers on the scorecard this weekend. Good times at the GBO. Can't imagine how good world's will be if DD repeats the GBO atmosphere but bigger.
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  #210  
Old 04-23-2013, 03:49 PM
Cgkdisc Cgkdisc is offline
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Updated schedule to handle increased division sizes:
http://www.pdga.com/files/documents/....9_-_DRAFT.pdf
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