#51  
Old 08-19-2013, 03:01 PM
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smyith smyith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JC17393 View Post
That is the generally accepted means of dealing with the issue if contacting the TD is impractical, but it's not official in any way (meaning there's no officially documented procedure that indicates that is how players should proceed).
now here is something the pDGA should be using their time to address. instead of leaving the rule half completed by saying you cant play in groups of 2.
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  #52  
Old 08-19-2013, 03:07 PM
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jobwilson jobwilson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JC17393 View Post
That is the generally accepted means of dealing with the issue if contacting the TD is impractical, but it's not official in any way (meaning there's no officially documented procedure that indicates that is how players should proceed).

There might be reason for the TD to move one or both players to completely different groups than the ones immediately preceding or following the original group. For example, if it was a threesome sandwiched between two foursomes and the TD has other threesomes on the course, creating two fivesomes might not be ideal since it could slow the pace of the round.

Of course, if that is the result of a player no-showing round 2 (or 3 or 4) with no notice, grinding the pace of play because of overlarge groups is just another PITA to justify dinging the no-show with an 888.
I'm speaking in a broader scope of "the horn just blew to tee off and our 3rd is absent".
Obviously if it is possible to do some quick shuffling that would be ideal.

But if I'm playing a tournament and the situation arises, I'm going to use my judgment, avoid contacting the TD and just split the group.
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  #53  
Old 08-19-2013, 03:19 PM
JC17393 JC17393 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smyith View Post
so let me get this straight. you say there is no issue when players check in cause the TD can fix the cards. then you say well when they dont show up for a 3some there is a problem. well why would you put a card together with someone who didnt check-in? whats the point of player check-in? if the player doesnt check in 15 minutes before the players meeting or whatever, that should be plenty of time to re-work the cards. if they no show after checking in, ya that causes some confusion, but wouldn't someone coming up just minutes before the tee off and telling you that their leaving? same delay and hassle but you wont penalize them for it? you are just twisting the rule around to fit your desires.

once again you are talking about leaving in the middle of the round. im talking about not showing up. and still miss using the intention of the rule.
Nowhere am I referring to the middle of a round. Middle of the tournament, not middle of the round. Player check-in happens before the tournament starts. Generally, there is no check-in before round 2 if it's played on the same day as round 1. The board gets reset, players find out where to go and they go. No meeting, no head-count. I'm not sure how morning check-in is supposed to counteract the problem of a player quitting at lunch time and not bothering to tell anyone.

To the bolded part, it isn't the same delay. Not in the least. You're talking about a slight inconvenience well before the round is scheduled to start. I'm talking about a huge inconvenience as the round begins because the entire body of players is scattered around the course. There's no way you're going to call everyone back and reorder cards at that point. Rarely is a player deciding to quit and leave a tournament moments before a round begins. That player is usually leaving tracks in the parking lot moments after the previous round ended. So the three second courtesy of "I'm not coming back" shouldn't disrupt the TD's efforts to set the board for round 2 in the least.


Quote:
Originally Posted by smyith View Post
i fully understand your guys point. "the player put a hassle on me so i think i should be able to use this rule to punish them for it." however, i disagree with you simply based on the fact that there is no rating manipulation going on by not showing. your entire argument is based on hassles for the TD, not rating manipulation.
You quoted the article that states flat out that the 888 code is to be used for situations in which a player leaves a tournament without informing the TD. We're not arguing something that is unintended by the rule behind the code. Yes, the 888 code is primarily designed to identify ratings manipulation, but by the PDGA's own words, it is not strictly for ratings manipulation. There is a viable alternative use.
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  #54  
Old 08-19-2013, 04:12 PM
archmage archmage is offline
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I'd also like to add that even not showing up for a round can be considered ratings manipulation. I know people who tend to quit every time they have an off day. It might be in the middle of the round, or just not showing up for the next round(s). And when they play all the rounds of a tournament when they're playing great, and only one round (if that) when they're not playing great, most of the rounds their rating is based off of are the rounds when they're playing at their best. And then their rating isn't reflective on how they play on average, but how they play on their good days.
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  #55  
Old 08-19-2013, 08:47 PM
Matt B. Matt B. is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smyith View Post
stupid....its really not a hassle imo. but whatever, its the pDGA so its to be expected that they would spend their time on something like this....
Said no TD ever.
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  #56  
Old 08-19-2013, 09:19 PM
doink32 doink32 is offline
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Smile DNF, but at least leave a note.

I got the wicked bubbleys right at the beginning of the 4th round of my local B-tier tourney last year and had to drop out (the first time in 11 years) I really did not want to mention it to any body so I just said my stomach hurt and I bounced,but I did drop by and tell the T.D. after I took a break.IT is the lest you could do for all of the T.D.s efforts whether you are playing good or bad.
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  #57  
Old 08-19-2013, 11:07 PM
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cefire cefire is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smyith View Post
now here is something the pDGA should be using their time to address. instead of leaving the rule half completed by saying you cant play in groups of 2.
has anyone told you recently that you are completely clueless
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  #58  
Old 08-19-2013, 11:13 PM
Dana Dana is offline
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Interesting thoughts.
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  #59  
Old 08-20-2013, 12:19 AM
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jenb jenb is offline
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888 is BS. People who leave for legitimate reasons have been hit with the 888 and it will continue to happen. It's a heavy handed non-solution for an insignificant "problem."
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  #60  
Old 08-20-2013, 01:39 AM
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mashnut mashnut is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jenb View Post
888 is BS. People who leave for legitimate reasons have been hit with the 888 and it will continue to happen. It's a heavy handed non-solution for an insignificant "problem."
So far you've given one example, and in that case the player didn't end up with an 888 after a brief chat with the TD.

If you haven't been a TD, I don't think it's fair to say it's an insignificant problem, it causes extra time and hassle for the TD and it's just plain rude. Obviously there are times when circumstances out of your control come up, but again, it's not a permanent thing, the TD can replace that with 999 if you give them a good reason.
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