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-   -   Am Payouts stifle pro growth? (https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134052)

DiscFifty 05-04-2019 01:32 AM

Am Payouts stifle pro growth?
 
Would there be more players turning pro (or at least sooner?) if ams didn't get pay outs such as merch, player packs, etc? :popcorn:

Armus Patheticus 05-04-2019 02:49 AM

Pro... hilarious.

DavidSauls 05-04-2019 07:53 AM

Are you changing any other parameters in your hypothetical?

If tournaments had the same entry fees and players packs, but no payouts, maybe some people would move up....but maybe ams would play fewer tournaments, and there'd be fewer players in the pipeline. And for those that are there, the opportunity to pay an even higher entry fee for a small chance at winning something might not be enticing.

Of course, you could change any number of variables---entry fee, players pack, funds to pro purse---and get different results.

Fewer Ams might also mean lower purses in the Pro division, as TDs wouldn't be able to profit off the margin on all that merch, to either sponsor the pros or cover event expenses.

Perhaps instructive are the events where the Am division is trophy-only. Ams still fill those divisions, rather than moving up.

*

The counter question would be, would it matter? Would having more of the current Ams play in Pro divisions do any good for the TD or the sport? The only people who I see would benefit would be the people who are already playing Pro and winning, as they'd have more money in the purse from the additional players who aren't winning anything.

ohtobediscing 05-04-2019 09:02 AM

Am participation in tournaments would disappear, which would definitely cut pro payouts. For the events I see occurring in Portland /Biloxi /Boise, there don't seem to be enough pros to fill them (except BSF).

elmexdela 05-04-2019 09:05 AM

why does anyone need a handout

read between the lines

jeffmonty 05-04-2019 11:39 AM

I personally am playing fewer tournaments already now because the entry fees have gone up so much to pad the pro purse. I don't care about paying pros, and I don't need more towels/minis/koozies in a player's pack, so the value isn't in it for me anymore. Why pay $70 to play with a bunch of guys I already pay nothing to play all the time with?

I'm alot more selective now.

jmdaire27 05-04-2019 01:29 PM

Maybe for individuals like myself, no. Truth be told, I don’t really care. I’d just hope those who can compete at higher levels locally actually do, instead of “bagging.”

I like playing tourneys. I will play in ~a handful a year. I have a goal to improve my rating and eventually make it to “pro” status. I hope to play pro at some point (aside from local unsanctioned events where pro is arbitrary; I usually play pro there, fwiw).

That being said, I have the desire to play more C tiers than higher, these days. I like to get in two rounds in a day, it is less expensive, and the overall demeanor is more lax.

Anyway, I think the future growth of the sport starts with the AMs. Get more people involved at lower levels and participation/attendance will grow.

DiscFifty 05-04-2019 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffmonty (Post 3447942)
I don't need more towels/minis/koozies in a player's pack, so the value isn't in it for me anymore. Why pay $70 to play with a bunch of guys I already pay nothing to play all the time with?

I 100% agree.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidSauls (Post 3447916)
The only people who I see would benefit would be the people who are already playing Pro and winning, as they'd have more money in the purse from the additional players who aren't winning anything.

I don't know how it is in your neck of the woods, but here in the DFW area we have plenty of ams that could compete with the local pros. A local pro I was chatting with the other day suggested if higher rated ams didn't win so much merch they would probably move up, hence my op. Would you rather win 3rd-5th place as a pro, or 1st-3rd as an am? I guess to some it depends on how much money or merch you might win. I am all on board for trophy only events. Those are pretty much non existent around here.

DavidSauls 05-04-2019 06:37 PM

That just sounds like a local pro wanting to take their money.

It doesn't answer the question: Who else would benefit, by having more pros and fewer advanced players?

It strikes me as a solution without a problem.

discgolfer25 05-04-2019 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiscFifty (Post 3447979)
I 100% agree.



I don't know how it is in your neck of the woods, but here in the DFW area we have plenty of ams that could compete with the local pros. A local pro I was chatting with the other day suggested if higher rated ams didn't win so much merch they would probably move up, hence my op. Would you rather win 3rd-5th place as a pro, or 1st-3rd as an am? I guess to some it depends on how much money or merch you might win. I am all on board for trophy only events. Those are pretty much non existent around here.

I think the vast majority of AMs move up too early. My personal opinion is just because you can compete at the “local pro” level doesn’t mean you should move up to pro. Most “local pros” would be better off playing advanced than moving up. I could see DFW being different bc of how large it is, but in the disc golf communities I have been in, people start hearing “bagger” and get pressured into moving up if they win one advanced tournament and are rated in the 930s. That person proceeds to move up when in reality, they are a middle of the pack AM nationally.


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