OK guys, I need y'all to talk me off the ledge because I am *this close* to pulling another gyro mold out of the bag. I love a beautiful hyzerflipped Vanish for max distance and tailwind crushes, but that thing just, well, vanishes. Half of my lost discs this year (3 out of 6) have been Vanishes. And I'm just not convinced that the uber-flippy distance driver is a slot that needs filling anymore.

I've tried to think back to how many strokes the Vanish saves me in an average month, and I'm pretty sure the answer is 1 at the most. Then I think how many strokes it costs me in the same time span and it's much higher. It's a sweet, sweet flyer when all cylinders are firing but when not it gets ugly in a hurry. Maybe 9 speed discs are the fastest flip monsters I can reasonably bag. Faster than that and the understability and speed combo just gets unruly too often.

Good to know. I've never bonded with a putter quite like the Entropy. The flat top and faster edge plays well for me on approach and in the circle. I can also forehand roll them a long way. A sticky electron would be nice for catching chains. I like 'em pretty light - 167-168 - and I haven't seen any of the circuit ones in that range. I pop these out to about 250' with a slow smooth pull. I love the control and I don't have to torque them. Being a 4 speed really works well for me.

There's a big jump in distance for me from the 250' Entropy to the 350' Matrix. I throw my FR Matrixes (168-171) at just about every hole. It was the disc that was missing from my game for most of 2 decades. I now confidently park holes in that 300-350' range without a driver - which is just huge for control. I don't feel like I'm rushing on the teepad to get more torque and I actually throw these further than my 157 Craves.

I have my days where an Envy flies great for me. I have tried different weights and plastics. I'm back to 168 Plasma. There are drives where I'm impressed with it's flight - and I can hit 300' with them - but more often than not, I feel like it's dying off too soon. Like if it was a 4 speed, it'd do what I want - but at 3, it's not got quite enough speed out of my hand to net that 20-30' more feet I'm looking for. I keep hoping MVP will release like a 4 4 0 1 hybrid putter using the Entropy as it's core. I have my doubts that'll happen.

I have the same problem with Inertias. I lost 5 last season. I've nearly lost one on numerous occasions this year and lucked out - finding them dangling from limbs, rolled into the underbrush, etc. Bad luck disc for me.

Fission Waves for the both of you!!!!

Ohm is 2-5-0-1 broken in Envy with more distance potential.


Fission Waves are crazy, long gentle anny turn from almost flat.. Gotta go somewhere open and really bomb em.

I'm out, gotta find my beer.

How do your Fission Waves compare to lightweight Plasma Waves?

Less stable, I only tried throwing em in the woods so far and throwing them against my 155 plasma is next. Just easy to turn, real nice ride but you know :D of course they only showed up yesterday so: Honeymoon!

The highlight was long easy turning distance down a tunnel only about 200' when it should have stabled out (for an ace :D) it kept holding the anhyzer until it hit the tree at about 250. Would have been nice to know what full distance would have been.

The 148 is "almost" understable out of the box, the 162 (jiffy pop top) is the closest to the 155 plasma. It might be a touch less stable still. I threw a few hyzers over the neighbors trailer and they held the line well.

Tossed a few FH, burned a few haha but on the whole real gentle turn that it just didn't come out of until late when thrown flat (to touch of anny). On a hyzer FH they held the line and didn't flip much, you could see it try but still has that Wave kind of stability.

Threw some high anhyzer about 130' as well haha, held the turn and bent in 20' before stabling out. Point being they could double for fairway duties as well as max D

About my experience with Envy's I have two different run Plasma's and they are nothing similar in terms of flight and feel.
https://i.ibb.co/PMnph9B/envy-s.jpg

I only bag the firm one and I prefer the neutron Ohm to the soft ones. Ohm seems to have more glide and is also more resistant to high speed turn.

Yeah the softer or lower, flatter top will make it easier to turn. I'm guessing since the feel different the black one is a tall top or domed slightly. The dome creates moderation in turn and as it breaks in can make for more glide (or a slower hyzer finish).

The ohm has more glide, I don't know why it's more resistant to high speed turn unless you've had the blue plasma for a few years. Though the Ohm really just loves to fly straighter, I can **** the bed and it still goes straight-ish.

All I wrote above was about new discs. Out of the box, the old stamp (on the left) is way more stable and it's also made from a stiffer plasma plastic. When ripped hard on a hyzer release, Ohm holds straight, while new stamp Envy turns over. The old stamp Envy flips up for a while but comes out and fades earlier than the Ohm. I also can't put a heavy FH on neirther new Envy nor the Ohm. They both burn on heavy torque. I can get the Ohm to around 310-320 on a good throw - straight as an arrow.

I'm pretty sure the left stamp is the new one, but thanks for the input on the runs' differences. Wondering if this applies to other molds too, or just Envy. Kinda bummed if it applies to all molds, since I liked the more understable old plasma on some other molds.