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R-Ogre 04-14-2020 05:41 PM

I’m pretty firmly in what some would call the “doomer” camp but even I think it’s time to take some representative communities, preferably ones that have had fairly minimal outbreaks and thorough testing, and peel back lockdown orders but by bit to see if the impacts are manageable.

brutalbrutus 04-14-2020 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R-Ogre (Post 3575353)
I’m pretty firmly in what some would call the “doomer” camp but even I think it’s time to take some representative communities, preferably ones that have had fairly minimal outbreaks and thorough testing, and peel back lockdown orders but by bit to see if the impacts are manageable.

I don't have a problem with it... if its actually done right. They need to have plenty of tests, antibody tests and medical resources sitting there waiting though. It can't be...


"Oh **** here it comes. We need to build a couple field hospitals."

R-Ogre 04-14-2020 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brutalbrutus (Post 3575364)
I don't have a problem with it... if its actually done right. They need to have plenty of tests, antibody tests and medical resources sitting there waiting though. It can't be...


"Oh **** here it comes. We need to build a couple field hospitals."

Exactly. The problem, of course, is that a certain individual integral to these plans doesn’t really do planning and preparation.

discerdoo 04-14-2020 06:43 PM

Florida is taking the lead designating pro rasslin' as an essential business and I take great comfort in that.

More seriously, I'm in mortgage banking and this rodeo is going to make the financial crisis of 08-10 look like a walk in the park. 45 days ago we were looking at a record year and now most of us are hoping we're still in business 3-6 months from now. Mortgage markets, health care, restaurants, airlines, hotels will all likely need bailouts to keep people working. Two trillion was just a start and future generations will be paying for this.

I've heard mention of "threading the needle" in terms of opening the economy back up and agree with that assessment. I certainly don't have great confidence that Trump has the steady hand to thread that needle.

ru4por 04-14-2020 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R-Ogre (Post 3575353)
I’m pretty firmly in what some would call the “doomer” camp but even I think it’s time to take some representative communities, preferably ones that have had fairly minimal outbreaks and thorough testing, and peel back lockdown orders but by bit to see if the impacts are manageable.

i agree, but I don't think there is anyplace close to your description. California governor is on the right track, imo. Here is what his six part plan would be.

The first was to expand testing to identify and isolate the infected, to stem the spread of the virus within the state.

The second phase was to maintain vigilant and protect vulnerable groups who are more at risk of the serious effects of the virus such as seniors and those with pre-exisiting conditions.

Number three was to address the ongoing needs of hospitals to cope with potential surges in the disease with necessary medical equipment and resources such as a “myriad of protective gear for that workforce”.

The governor said the state would need to move into frame four by continuing to collaborate with experts to develop therapies and treatments “to engage academia, to engage our research partners to engage those that are on the front lines”.

The “redrawing our floor plans” for businesses and facilities large and small to allow social distancing measures to continue to be implemented was the fifth point.

Finally was the through the redrafting of regulations and development of enforcement mechanisms to “toggle from stricter to looser interventions” such as stay-at-home orders.

I have lost nearly all faith in my fellow Americans to do the right thing. So, I am not sure I see a way to enact the above, without a catastrophic relapse in the virus numbers.

Halcón 04-14-2020 10:00 PM

We can't restart the economy without a lot more people getting sick. But it might be the only way. The only thing we can hope for is that the number of seriously ill don't overwhelm the hospitals.

What concerns me more than anything is what happens next school year (August and September). Tens of thousands of classrooms with snot-nosed kids, messy teenagers, and carefree young adults. If we don't get a handle on things by then...look out.

Ess-dog 04-14-2020 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halcón (Post 3575291)
It's not that people are fine with others dying. They're just seeing how these shutdowns and restrictions are affecting every aspect of our society, and getting worried...and rightfully so. We're in a lose-lose situation right now. It's gonna be bad, no matter what we do.

I think they are fine with people dying (at least fine with justifying it as unavoidable) if the alternative is a 50-60% loss of retirement funds and owing more than their house is worth. I'm not hearing a lot of altruistic sentiment right now. Mostly veiled eugenics survival of the fittest arguments for reopening.

ru4por 04-14-2020 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ess-dog (Post 3575524)
I think they are fine with people dying (at least fine with justifying it as unavoidable) if the alternative is a 50-60% loss of retirement funds and owing more than their house is worth. I'm not hearing a lot of altruistic sentiment right now. Mostly veiled eugenics survival of the fittest arguments for reopening.

it kind of boils down to a balancing act between the economy and the healthcare system, IMO. I mean, it is obviously far more complicated, but those, kind of, have to be the tipping points. If you can somehow open enough of the economy to stave of mass bankruptcy and still have the healthcare system stave off mass death, I think you win. I personally don't believe that time is now, but the economy is not going to continue to wait. I am just not willing to put tens of thousands of lives at risk.

ru4por 04-14-2020 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halcón (Post 3575502)
We can't restart the economy without a lot more people getting sick. But it might be the only way. The only thing we can hope for is that the number of seriously ill don't overwhelm the hospitals.

What concerns me more than anything is what happens next school year (August and September). Tens of thousands of classrooms with snot-nosed kids, messy teenagers, and carefree young adults. If we don't get a handle on things by then...look out.

I'm not sure you can reopen schools next year. I believe we are in for a very harsh winter resurgence in the virus, schools would just be super-spreader breeding factories.

Hampstead 04-15-2020 12:06 AM

Life as we know it is going to be changed for quite sometime. This won't be easy and it's going to hurt. Of course it sucks. Americans love their freedom. But, the sooner some folks recognize the gravity of the moment, the better off they'll be in the long run.


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