Disc Golf Course Review

Disc Golf Course Review (https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/index.php)
-   Technique & Strategy (https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=4)
-   -   The Twitch of the Hips (https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showthread.php?t=137717)

Tinkles 12-01-2020 12:08 PM

This thread has been really helpful for me and I appreciate all the contributions.

I think I have had a few aha moments of understanding some things like the relationship of the spine/chest to hips that RandyC has hit on. I always assumed that the X-factor was this separation created by spine rotation but can see now that I can rotate my shoulders more through contracting my right pec and left lats and traps but that my rib cage/sternum pretty much stay with my hips. The X-factor is kind of an artificial rotation in this regard.

The pros in the numerous gifs on this thread (thanks SW and Rodeo) clearly show to me that the hips are getting into a locked position 30 to 45 degrees off target line and keeping it there in the backswing which is really just the final step. The run up is just there to give you some more energy to put into the brace but what is important is getting the hips into a position at that angle relative to the target at the end and keeping it there during the backswing.

Like Rodeo, I have been getting my hips/shoulders more perpendicular to the target early in the backswing and then spinning them back. This spinning feels much more athletic to me and probably is a more athletic motion, but that doesnít mean the results are better. It feels like my brace is stronger when I spin but I definitely plateaued with that approach. It has also resulted in some hip pain inside my right side as I think my spinning makes your hips work harder and puts a lot of torque on that joint.

It is difficult to go from spinning to sliding at an angle but Iíve been working on it and have quickly had great results. Iíve only been working on this for a while but have gone from hitting 350 consistently with occasional pops out to 380 with my shryke, to now hitting 370 consistently with more occasional pops out to 400 with my wraiths. That may not sound like much but it is huge for me to know that I can throw my 9 speed drivers 350 now. What is weird is that it feels less athletic and when I get to my disc I am surprised that it went so far. Hitting 400 with my wraith the other day on a throw that really only popped to flat without much turn was crazy for me. I assumed it was a 360 throw but got out there and was 50í passed the 350 mark.

The best part is knowing that usually such a drastic change results in a distance loss at first as my body becomes acclimated. I feel like once I get this muscle memory dialed in, I actually can make more progress which I havenít for a while.

Rodeo, I get where you are coming from. I got into this game late too at 40, and have been playing for 2 years now. It feels like an uphill battle and race against time knowing Iím already over a decade past my prime and getting older every day. I think you are like me in that you are a little obsessive and want to keep improving, especially knowing it is a race against the clock. It is hard to make a change that feels like its moving backward at first and less athletic a motion. I mostly play with guys from a league Iím in who are 10-15 years younger than me and I like being able to throw further than almost all of them and donít want to lose anything. For me at least though, the results speak for themselves. Honestly, I think it is impressive that you are hitting 350 a few months in. I have friends that have played with me for 2 years and still are throwing shrykes and terns on anhyzer to get a flex out to 320. I would encourage you to have a little bit more of an open mind on the concepts explored here and patience in knowing that sometimes it can feel like you have to take a step back to progress.

Anyways, thanks to everyone contributing here. This thread is my homework for the winter.

Tinkles 12-04-2020 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandyC (Post 3644211)
Once again there are too many threads here to discuss pretty much the same thing but you could leave out the strong part in that term and just say arming. You can either do it with muscle tension or with a limp arm. Infact your throw is a good example of limp arming the disc.

Man running backwards with an internally rotated front shoulder turns forward and swings a limp arm out to external rotation, there is no shoulder turn which means there is no hips. That front shoulder gives the illusion and maybe the feel as if your shoulder were turning but thats not true. So you are just going from neutral to open.
https://youtu.be/RIY8hZh9UWw

Can you expound a little more on the shoulder discussion here or point me to a thread you think hits on this topic. I'm trying to fix overturning as well and wanted to understand a little more about the correct vs incorrect shoulder turn you talk about here. Thanks.

seedlings 12-04-2020 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tinkles (Post 3664959)
Can you expound a little more on the shoulder discussion here or point me to a thread you think hits on this topic. I'm trying to fix overturning as well and wanted to understand a little more about the correct vs incorrect shoulder turn you talk about here. Thanks.

This whole video is excellent. Specifically talks about shoulders at the 10:00 mark


RandyC 12-04-2020 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tinkles (Post 3664959)
Can you expound a little more on the shoulder discussion here or point me to a thread you think hits on this topic. I'm trying to fix overturning as well and wanted to understand a little more about the correct vs incorrect shoulder turn you talk about here. Thanks.

One is going behind you and the other past you.

Twistedhorse 12-05-2020 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seedlings (Post 3639837)

when does he start to rotate his hips? after the disc is in the powerpocket?

RoDeO 12-05-2020 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twistedhorse (Post 3665474)
when does he start to rotate his hips? after the disc is in the powerpocket?

It's dynamic. Watch his rear leg that is the clue. It can't turn inwards or forward without the hip rotating. So, to ask another way- when exactly does his rear leg start to turn inwards/forward? While the disc is still back before it comes into the power pocket.

Twistedhorse 12-05-2020 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoDeO (Post 3665485)
It's dynamic. Watch his rear leg that is the clue. It can't turn inwards or forward without the hip rotating. So, to ask another way- when exactly does his rear leg start to turn inwards/forward? While the disc is still back before it comes into the power pocket.

I've heard somewhere that you shouldn't rotate your hips before your right foot stamps down, but not sure if it's false or not

RoDeO 12-05-2020 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twistedhorse (Post 3665487)
I've heard somewhere that you shouldn't rotate your hips before your right foot stamps down, but not sure if it's false or not

I think it's better to say you shouldn't start to bring the shoulders around until your right foot comes down fully. Don't worry about what the hips are doing. The hip turn is dynamic and happens automatically as your weight shifts from rear to front. If you tried to wait until you had all your weight shifted before turning the hip you would not be able to even turn the hips at all.

Twistedhorse 12-05-2020 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoDeO (Post 3665499)
I think it's better to say you shouldn't start to bring the shoulders around until your right foot comes down fully. Don't worry about what the hips are doing. The hip turn is dynamic and happens automatically as your weight shifts from rear to front. If you tried to wait until you had all your weight shifted before turning the hip you would not be able to even turn the hips at all.

That's part of my problem, I'm using like 0% of my hips

DanJon 12-05-2020 06:30 PM

Quick question, can the person who started this thread break 400 feet?

RoDeO 12-05-2020 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanJon (Post 3665515)
Quick question, can the person who started this thread break 400 feet?

Just curious- what would that have to do with anything?

RoDeO 12-05-2020 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twistedhorse (Post 3665505)
That's part of my problem, I'm using like 0% of my hips

Let your arms hang loose at your side and practice swinging your hips around and letting your arms swing outwards just from that motion. That's the feel you want to initiate the pull. Next practice thinking your hips and torso are the hand that cracks the bull whip and your arm is the whip. Practice holding your arm in back of you in tjat reachback position then use your hips and torso to pull the whip.

SaROCaM 12-06-2020 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoDeO (Post 3665598)
Just curious- what would that have to do with anything?

It qualifies the source of the advice.

Who would you rather listen to regarding throwing form: someone who throws in the 400s or someone who throws in the 300s?

Who would you rather listen to about running: someone who runs a mile under 5 minutes or someone who struggles to break 10 minutes?

Who would you rather listen to about getting stronger: someone who has an elite powerlifting total in competition, or someone who benches 205 with a huge arch in their back and their butt coming off the bench?

Not to say that the less qualified can't be the source of useful information (can learn from their mistakes, have insights more appropriate for that level, etc.) but it is a quick way to evaluate the likelihood of the quality of the information.

RoDeO 12-06-2020 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaROCaM (Post 3665718)
It qualifies the source of the advice.

Who would you rather listen to regarding throwing form: someone who throws in the 400s or someone who throws in the 300s?

Who would you rather listen to about running: someone who runs a mile under 5 minutes or someone who struggles to break 10 minutes?

Who would you rather listen to about getting stronger: someone who has an elite powerlifting total in competition, or someone who benches 205 with a huge arch in their back and their butt coming off the bench?

Not to say that the less qualified can't be the source of useful information (can learn from their mistakes, have insights more appropriate for that level, etc.) but it is a quick way to evaluate the likelihood of the quality of the information.

I think the poster who asked was trolling.

txmxer 12-06-2020 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoDeO (Post 3665485)
It's dynamic. Watch his rear leg that is the clue. It can't turn inwards or forward without the hip rotating. So, to ask another way- when exactly does his rear leg start to turn inwards/forward? While the disc is still back before it comes into the power pocket.

You donít know how a ball and socket works do you ?

RoDeO 12-06-2020 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by txmxer (Post 3665837)
You donít know how a ball and socket works do you ?

Well enough to know that the ball and socket where the leg attaches to the pelvis is the ball and socket "hip" joint. When that joint turns inward it's called the internal rotation if the hip joint- thus why I said you can't turn the leg inwards without the hip joint rotating. That's why they call it hip internal rotation. Thus why I said watch the rear leg because when it starts turning inwards or forwards toward the target the hip joint on that side is rotating. The rotation of the hips lead to the actual movement or rotation of the pelvis.

DiscFifty 12-08-2020 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by azplaya25 (Post 3639986)
All 4 of these pros have their front heels on the ground before they rotate and swing.

i.e. "Brace"

RoDeO 12-08-2020 09:11 AM

The strong "brace" happens during the dynamic hip rotation.

sidewinder22 12-08-2020 01:43 PM

Bracing is dynamic.

seedlings 12-08-2020 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sidewinder22 (Post 3666651)
Bracing is dynamic.

This will be an interesting discourse. Weíre all ears.

RoDeO 12-08-2020 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sidewinder22 (Post 3666651)
Bracing is dynamic.

Yes very much so. It begins, comes on strong until it is in a "strong brace" and then eases off and the foot pivots around as the brace eases up.

RowingBoats 12-08-2020 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sidewinder22 (Post 3666651)
Bracing is dynamic.

What do you think about comparing the brace leg to the pole in a vault? This visualization has helped me really cement getting on that leg and riding a knee extension into the swing.

sidewinder22 12-08-2020 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RowingBoats (Post 3666665)
What do you think about comparing the brace leg to the pole in a vault? This visualization has helped me really cement getting on that leg and riding a knee extension into the swing.

Whatever works.


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:17 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.