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DavidSauls 12-04-2020 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BogeyNoMore (Post 3664829)
I better resolve myself to being last in line...
At least I can work from home.

Me, too.....I've said that I wish those who decline, would give me their spot. But at least the
back of the line will move faster with people ahead of us, jumping out.

During the semi-shutdowns back in April & May, there were a lot of claims, and some curious decisions, as to what was "essential". I expect the same again, with most of the cases having some merit.

Therealgoat 12-04-2020 07:39 AM

It's hard not to have reservations about the vaccine, though I do intend to get it when it's available. Yes, it's cutting edge technology, but that's precisely what makes it scary. Instructing your cells to make something? You know your cells have an instruction set to self-destruct too. Problem is you'd like literally 10 years of study to see the long term effects of something like this, and we just don't have that kind of time. There has been all kinds of medicines or treatments in the past that we've stopped using because of their side effects, seemed great at the time. That's what I'm worried about.

But I have to worry about more than myself. If I'm being honest, I think my family and myself would be alright, but my mother's probably a 50/50 shot at surviving a severe case, and that's not a risk I'm willing to take. I'll get it just to protect her.

As far as being mandatory @ru4por, kinda funny. My buddy works at a hospital and they made employment conditional on getting the Flu shot this year (previously it had been OR you have to wear a mask all the time), but they aren't making the Covid vaccine mandatory. They lost 13% of their employees to the mandatory Flu shot policy this year. My guess is since they're also slated to get a first batch in December, they'll make it mandatory next year, just not right now.

ru4por 12-04-2020 08:01 AM

Not science, but looks like a good dose of common sense. 5 worst places to go to get the 'rona.

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/almo...214735157.html

txmxer 12-04-2020 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3664836)
Not science, but looks like a good dose of common sense. 5 worst places to go to get the 'rona.

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/almo...214735157.html

I donít go to bars or hang out in cafes. Skip dine in for a while. Check

I can stay home and commune with the spaghetti monster. Check.

I have my doubts about hotels. Yes, lots of time spent in the space, but induhvudually. And there is a cleaning process, that now seems to include a Lysol bath.

Iím 95% of 80% good.

DavidSauls 12-04-2020 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3664836)
Not science, but looks like a good dose of common sense. 5 worst places to go to get the 'rona.

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/almo...214735157.html

How much of the spread is in homes, from the person who brought the virus home (possibly from one of those places)?

I sort of had the impression that those places were the source of a lot of community spread -- that is, spread around the community, from household to household -- but a chunk of the new cases came were in the households that they brought it to.

I'm also curious about how informal gatherings come into play. Visiting friends and family, in small groups of a couple of households. Seems I've seen reports that these are driving a lot of the spread, too.

BogeyNoMore 12-04-2020 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3664836)
Not science, but looks like a good dose of common sense. 5 worst places to go to get the 'rona.

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/almo...214735157.html

No real surprises here. Pure conjecture on my part but it stands to reason that...

Place where lots of different people go to spend a decent amount of time in the same place, are more likely to provide a vector for the virus.

Also consider that us "paranoid" people taking greater precautions to reduce spread are less likely to spend time on those places, while there's a good chance people who frequent those places may be less concerned about precautions.

...it kinda makes even more sense.

disco40 12-04-2020 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monocacy (Post 3664799)
10% infected this year is not unprecedented, but 7% in a month seems crazy-high. Do you mind me asking what kind of workplace, and what precautions folks are taking (masks, distancing, staying home when sick, etc.)?

CDC data shows 463 cases per 100K people in the last 7 days in your area (0.46% per week) which is worrisome but still way less than the 7% per month.

Big retail store in MO. Everyone is wearing masks and at least trying to distance - sometimes unavoidable closeness happens - and yeah anybody with symptoms has to stay home and get tested before they can come back. Cashiers have big sneeze guard plastic that covers most of the register area (though there is a big open section to hand off bags) and access to gloves it they want them. I'd say our precautions are very good on paper, but in practice, it's not possible to operate without risk. A small percentage of our customers seem oblivious to not coughing near others, respecting space and barriers, etc.

ThrowaEnvy 12-04-2020 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidSauls (Post 3664846)

I'm also curious about how informal gatherings come into play. Visiting friends and family, in small groups of a couple of households. Seems I've seen reports that these are driving a lot of the spread, too.

Well according to our provincial health gal Bonnie Henry that is a major driving force with our new infections. These small informal gatherings or visiting 6 people one day and a different 6 another day has created reasonable spread.

She has clamped back down on sports like recreational hockey after some BC old timer hockey team (rec league) went to Alberta for a game and brought it back to their town and family. Last I read there was almost 20 cases directly attributed to that.

There was also a case study of 1 asymptomatic who went to a gym, spread some corona there.. From that single case and people who were members in more than one gym etc they have traced 106 cases to that single person.

We are advised not to travel out of our local area, keep Christmas small.... But I had to take the ferry last week off island and it was packed. Got some homeowners taking the ferry back and forth 3 times or more per week. Got others who are coming over every weekend too, the micro manager type that want to meet about every detail, constantly.

Monocacy 12-04-2020 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by disco40 (Post 3664856)
Big retail store in MO. Everyone is wearing masks and at least trying to distance - sometimes unavoidable closeness happens - and yeah anybody with symptoms has to stay home and get tested before they can come back. Cashiers have big sneeze guard plastic that covers most of the register area (though there is a big open section to hand off bags) and access to gloves it they want them. I'd say our precautions are very good on paper, but in practice, it's not possible to operate without risk. A small percentage of our customers seem oblivious to not coughing near others, respecting space and barriers, etc.

Thank you for the description. Big and retail involve some risks for sure, but it sounds like your employer has done a lot of what can be done to mitigate the risks.

Customers coughing into a mask would be safer than no mask, but I don't know whether your store is in a position to require customers to wear masks.

If an employee is aware of a potential exposure, is there a system for them to report that to someone at work and get paid while they quarantine and get tested? If not, then employees have an incentive to show up to work while infectious.

If an employee tests positive, is there someone at work who does internal contact tracing and advises secondary contacts to quarantine until tested? Health departments don't always have the resources do this, in my experience.

Good luck!

ru4por 12-04-2020 10:05 AM

Is anybody here doing any stockpiling of supplies? No judging, just curious.

Our weekly grocery store shopping looks quite different today than a couple months ago. We are not anywhere near full blown prepping, but we now have a pantry with a stock of soup, canned goods, pasta sauce, pasta, rice, flour..... We also come home with a dozen rolls of TP each week. The freezer has about double our usual meat selection, though we don't really store much meat, as a rule. We are cooking at home 7 days a week, so we eat up what we generally buy in a week. A meat or fresh fruit/veggie shortage would hit us pretty hard. We have also stocked up on soap, shampoo, toothpaste, deodorant....not so much of fear of shortages, but to hopefully eliminate the need to spend time shopping for such, if things continue to get worse.

zontar 12-04-2020 10:12 AM

not stockpiling, but we could probably live off what we have for a month is we were creative.

DavidSauls 12-04-2020 10:23 AM

Not stockpiling. Well, maybe a little....I've bought a little more than I normally would, just as a cushion. About a month ago my local store was almost out of paper towels -- they only had 8-roll packages, which was a bit much. But it was back to normal last week.

I've noticed that in a low-population area, we don't seem to suffer the runs on the store that cities do. I guess fewer people, can only buy so much. Supply chains are a minor concern. My main thought is to have enough in case I have to quarantine myself, so maybe I buy 2 of something that I'd normally only buy 1.

Therealgoat 12-04-2020 10:45 AM

Supply chain is a real concern, was first made aware of it reading the book "Light's Out", about our country's (lack) of preparedness for grid-wide outages. We have about a 2-week food supply chain, if it stops cold, we'd have people starving inside a month - or at least reduced to criminal activity to procure food. It would get ugly fast.

My father always kept an emergency supply kit in the basement, maybe a weeks' worth of stuff. My sister and her (admittedly overzealous husband) now have about a 1-month supply in their basement as they lived in a hard hit area earlier this year.

Our town water supply got a funky odor recently, and we were advised not to drink it (could still shower), it's surprising how much fresh water you go through, even without counting showers/toilet. They handed out cases of water at the local rec center to ease the burden - I'm not sure what the supplies looked like at the stores around town after that though.

I think a 2-week supply is a sweet spot. I can envision disruptions of that magnitude, either from power outages, crazy weather (I've actually been stuck in my own driveway for a 3-day span before from feet of snow), pandemics, what have you - where you need to rely on your own stock for a while until things get back up and running either via large shipping/amazon/stores. But honestly if its anything more than two weeks, unless you can hunt and already have a garden going, emergency stockpile isn't going to sustain you indefinitely.

Sorry for sounding like a doomer. Time to build that bunker with my 401k...

Broken Shoulder 12-04-2020 11:16 AM

I have six months worth of denture cleaner.

DavidSauls 12-04-2020 11:20 AM

I meant that supply chain is a modest concern, in the current circumstance. At least, to me. A little hedging is one thing. I know people who are still working through their April toilet paper purchases.

Columbia, SC -- a mid-sized city -- lost its water supply in 2015, when a flood damaged the water plant. You definitely notice water when you don't have it.

JuanA 12-04-2020 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3664873)
Is anybody here doing any stockpiling of supplies? No judging, just curious.

...not so much of fear of shortages, but to hopefully eliminate the need to spend time shopping for such, if things continue to get worse.

I now have a stockpile, but it was mostly driven by the part I put in bold. I figure if I have to buy one of something, I might as well buy 2 and save a future trip to the store.

It evolved into a shelf I now keep in the basement, that I could probably live off of for a few months easy. There wouldn't be much variety, but I wouldn't go hungry. I also keep the necessities on hand as well.

Jay Dub 12-04-2020 11:32 AM

I bought an extra pack of TP because I was stuck with single ply for a while and the store is not back to normal with their stock of paper products. So I bought it while it was there. It was only a 6 = 18 pack.

McCready 12-04-2020 11:36 AM

Hate to admit it, but we have enough paper towels & toilet paper to last at least until next summer. Other stuff we are buying like normal. We get groceries delivered weekly and there haven’t been any shortages. We also get Butcher Box which is a great service for quality meats. We even got our Thanksgiving turkey from them.

Martin Dewgarita 12-04-2020 11:38 AM

I haven't bought TP yet this year :/

jakebake91 12-04-2020 11:41 AM

I have no problem with people reasonably stocking up on essentials. The one thing that bothered me most tho during the TP craze was that people who hadn't bought baby wipes in their life were stocking up on cases of those when TP ran out. As a father of two young ones, we were lucky that we had just bought our big case before things got too crazy, because I didn't see a baby wipes on the shelf for almost a month. Same goes for a family friend with a special needs son. The wipes she uses for him were gone. We actually shared a few packages of our baby wipes with them to help get them thru.

Stock up on what you need or think you need, but please, let's not get stupid again!

BogeyNoMore 12-04-2020 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3664873)
Is anybody here doing any stockpiling of supplies? No judging, just curious.

Our weekly grocery store shopping looks quite different today than a couple months ago. We are not anywhere near full blown prepping, but we now have a pantry with a stock of soup, canned goods, pasta sauce, pasta, rice, flour..... We also come home with a dozen rolls of TP each week. The freezer has about double our usual meat selection, though we don't really store much meat, as a rule. We are cooking at home 7 days a week, so we eat up what we generally buy in a week. A meat or fresh fruit/veggie shortage would hit us pretty hard. We have also stocked up on soap, shampoo, toothpaste, deodorant....not so much of fear of shortages, but to hopefully eliminate the need to spend time shopping for such, if things continue to get worse.

I'm in a pretty similar situation, scaled down for bachelor life. I've always bought value sized toiletries and paper good specifically to save money and need to buy them less frequently.

Lots of cooking and freezing contrainers of chili, stew, etc. Just trying to reduce time milling about in public. Pantry full of long shelf life items.

If needed, I restock basics when I go for produce or meat.

BogeyNoMore 12-04-2020 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Dewgarita (Post 3664907)
I haven't bought TP yet this year :/

...but you're not as full of $h!t as most folks.

uncle pennybags 12-04-2020 01:15 PM

I wish I was able to hold out until Option #2 was an viable choice. Sadly I decided to go with Option #1. My review 2/10 would not recommend.

Quote:

Originally Posted by McCready (Post 3664688)
I feel like Iíve been overly cautious with limiting social contact since March, and while the unprecedented speed of the vaccinesí development might be a genuine cause for concern, Iím getting the jab as soon as I possibly can.

I see it like this ó I have two risks to weigh:

1. Contract Covid. I see many people minimizing the risks, but itís impossible to know what YOUR risk is. You could have no symptoms, or a bad flu-like illness that goes away with no lingering issues, or a nightmarish month in the ICU and debilitating lung/brain/liver damage and PTSD for the next decade or three. If the risk of a really bad outcome is greater than zero, the logical thing (for me) is to assume the risk is high. Others take the less cautious approach and dress it up as bravery or embracing American liberty. Whatever. You look like an idiot to me, sorry. If you roll the dice and get snake eyes, itís not like losing a bet, ruining a relationship or losing a job. Your health is precious and your lifespan is finite. I take that seriously.

2. Get the vaccine and deal with unknown hidden long-term risks. From what Iíve read about how the vaccines work, not only is the risk minimal, but the mechanism of action is revolutionary. Youíre injected with mRNA molecules that instruct your body to manufacture proteins similar to the Covid virus, and this activates your immune system to make antibodies. This stuff is cutting edge, along the same lines as the gene therapies for cancer and other diseases that are being developed. Sickle cell anemia now has a cure thanks to this technology. I donít buy into the conspiracy nonsense, so I believe the results currently being published showing no major side effects. As depressing as I find our politics and other aspects of modern life, this is a chance to be part of something really big and inspiring.

So clearly I see option 2 as much less risky than option 1. But I could be wrong and the vaccine could turn me into a drooling vegetable or I could drop dead. I could get hit by a bus tomorrow too. I want to see my family and friends and feel normal again. The vaccines look like the surest path to get there.


Dcinmd 12-04-2020 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3664873)
Is anybody here doing any stockpiling of supplies? No judging, just curious.

We order a refrigerator rated for the Garage in early April. It took 6 months to arrive due to demand, the the delivery date was pushed back at least 3 times.

Stockpiled TP, Tissues, dry goods, wipes, frozen meats and Beer over the past 9 months. We try to keep at least a month supply at all times if not 2.

We good till at least February at the moment. Other than fresh goods and kitty food.

Monocacy 12-04-2020 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3664873)
Is anybody here doing any stockpiling of supplies? No judging, just curious.

Heh. Spousal unit grew up on a farm in the middle of Wisconsin, so stockpiling is our normal state of affairs. One time she was on work travel for a month, and I was able to subsist on existing supplies quite nicely except for fresh vegetables.

jakebake91 12-04-2020 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monocacy (Post 3664996)
Heh. Spousal unit grew up on a farm in the middle of Wisconsin.

You have a good taste in spousal units :)

DavidSauls 12-04-2020 10:07 PM

According to the NY Times estimator tool, I'm about 269,700,000th in line for the vaccine.

ru4por 12-04-2020 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidSauls (Post 3665232)
According to the NY Times estimator tool, I'm about 269,700,000th in line for the vaccine.

Lol.....could be worse.....but not by much.

BogeyNoMore 12-04-2020 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidSauls (Post 3665232)
According to the NY Times estimator tool, I'm about 269,700,000th in line for the vaccine.

...and I thought waiting in line at the deli counter was bad.

Nova P 12-05-2020 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidSauls (Post 3665232)
According to the NY Times estimator tool, I'm about 269,700,000th in line for the vaccine.

Yeah, I'm kind of screwed too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by New York Times
Based on your risk profile, we believe youíre in line behind 268.7 million people across the United States.

When it comes to Missouri, we think youíre behind 5.2 million others who are at higher risk in your state.

And in Buchanan County, youíre behind 80,000 others.

My county has a population of 87,000. So yeah. . . not good.

I guess I'll resume doing things in 2022.

joecoin 12-05-2020 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3664873)
Is anybody here doing any stockpiling of supplies? No judging, just curious.

We (2 people) started in May. My wife is high risk.

She has Amazoned a bunch of shelf-stable food, but most of it is stuff I don't like. Looks like she's planning on leaving me to scrounge.

We have 19 acres along a river, so I can fish and I have a magic bean stalk seed (I traded the cow for it), so I'm good.

biscoe 12-05-2020 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BogeyNoMore (Post 3665248)
...and I thought waiting in line at the deli counter was bad.

no soup for you! ;)

DavidSauls 12-05-2020 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidSauls (Post 3665232)
According to the NY Times estimator tool, I'm about 269,700,000th in line for the vaccine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ru4por (Post 3665244)
Lol.....could be worse.....but not by much.

I feel like that final scene in Beetlejuice.

When I first saw that figure, I thought, I'm 62. I can get to 65 and earn my Express Pass, before I can get to the front of this line. Suddenly, I've got a newfound interest in logistics, and how fast they can produce and move 400 million doses.

So, what's better for me? For a bunch of people ahead of me to refuse the vaccine, jumping out of line so I get to the front quicker? Or for 268 million to get it first, and shield me?

perklc 12-05-2020 08:24 AM

Where I am on the list really depends on when I could have access to the vaccine. I am obese, but I am also only in my mid-30s, am active, and all of my health stats are good, and I have no other underlying issues, so I don't know how high a doctor would rate my health risk. From January-April I will be an essential worker according to what my state would consider essential and will be working with several hundred people per week in an office setting (masks have to be worn, distancing enforced, plexiglass up where possible etc.); however, after April 15th, I would be working from home and have next to no contact with the general public. I get either 23 millionth in line or 268.7 millionth in line.

DavidSauls 12-05-2020 08:34 AM

Wonder if I can get a part-time apprentice job in an essential industry -- just an hour or two a month, no pay required, just a promotion on the priority list?

Broken Shoulder 12-05-2020 08:59 AM

Bribes have worked since basically forever, right?

zontar 12-05-2020 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Broken Shoulder (Post 3665298)
Bribes have worked since basically forever, right?

yeah, but us teachers don't have the money for it......

Broken Shoulder 12-05-2020 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zontar (Post 3665302)
yeah, but us teachers don't have the money for it......

Not every bribe involves money......

DavidSauls 12-05-2020 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Broken Shoulder (Post 3665298)
Bribes have worked since basically forever, right?

Probably a better idea than going to the black market. A little suspicious of the guy selling Pfizer vaccines from the trunk of his car. ("Exactly how good is your car's A/C, anyway?")

BogeyNoMore 12-05-2020 10:01 AM

Be wary of anyone who says,
"Pssst. Come here. I got a deal for you,"
...as they open their trenchcoat


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