Basically some just retain their flight better than others. I beat the crap out of a Neutron soft and it didn’t do anything to the flight. Don’t know if any are legit overstable. TP/VIP Harp can get that flight with more fade, but the Envy while awesome, I can never get to fade hard.

My sample of one sparkle proton is definitely more OS than my plasma and neutrons. Just started throwing a 165g eclipse that's similar to the plaz and neutrons in stability.

More OS Envy? I'd say Stabilizer....then Entropy. If you want something a good tick more OS but still has glide and distance potential, the Stabilizer is great. If you want a more Zone-like disc the Entropy is more like that, significantly more OS than an Envy tho.

And for the PYRO talk. I have only used the Circuit event Neutron/Plasma sparkle rim 176g. This thing is OS for sure but not a glideless knife. I really like it. Like a lot of gyro discs I can just feel the workability in the beginning of the flight but it has a nice hard fade at the end, its definitely OS - takes flex lines well and always fights out. I really like it. 5/4/0/3.5 is pretty accurate I think, maybe even just a 3 fade. But its more OS than an MD4 , more OS than a lot of things but not nearly as OS as a Justice.

My N Stabilizer is basically a deeper, more reliably OS version of my N Envy. That's all I got for you.

Proton Envy, max weight. If that's not enough, time for a different mold.

Eclipse is less stable and closer to neutron than proton. I love it! but not the droid you're looking for.

I'm glad that you expanded a bit on why you feel the Pyro lacks glide for a mid. We all know the Pyro is a mid, but it has a rim thickness of 1.6, which is as long of wing as a Stalker. Roc/Buzzz are 1.2cm for comparison. This is why I was comparing it to a fairway driver. At 100-150' a Pyro would have very little glide because it is a fast overstable mid being underthrown. I don't think it's fair to assess the Pyro's glide number based on this type of use. This is the territory of a putter/mid approach hybrid like the Zone rather than a mid/fairway hybrid like the Pyro.

I use the Envy / Entropy combo. I'm very picky about putter shape. Entropy will be the closest feel to the Envy - but it's faster and significantly more OS. I checked out the Stabalizer but didn't care for the shape. I guess it's closer to the Envy's flight but OS. So if feel is a big deal, check out Entropy. If you just want a bit more OS but feel ain't important, check out Stabalizer.

I throw the 165 Eclipse Envys as my driving putters. I was throwing 175 plasma but started having significant arm pain... so I went looking for lighter weight discs. The 165 Eclipse have enough beef to hold lines and I love the lighter weight. I tend to favor flat, anny, or flex lines so this works well for me.

I've slowly migrated all my discs to lighter weights. All my drivers are now 150 class Neutron. The one disc I can't seem to get the weight down on is the Entropy. Can't find 'em below 170.

I carry 168 Plasma and Eclipse Envys for putt approach. I use the Plasma in the circle and for anhyzer approach shots, the Eclipse for Hyzer approach.

The Pyro is not that overstable. It has about the same stability as the Kaxe and the Kaxe has a lest twice the glide.

I think we are using terms differently. Falling out of the sky does not mean overstable, that means it has a high stall speed. I can power down a Motion to a lower speed than I can the Pyro... does that mean that the Pyro is more OS than the Motion?

One of my new years goals is to set up a glossary of terms in a git repo. That way we can all have access to it and branch it and vote on which branch becomes the master. It could be that I am using the terms incorrectly

Particle?