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-   -   Relatively new player - am I doing something wrong? (https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80742)

MrDarkHorse 01-23-2013 06:23 PM

Relatively new player - am I doing something wrong?
Hey guys, couple questions.

I've been reading a lot and watching a lot of videos and then practicing to try and improve my form, but I've really only been playing for a couple of months.

One of the most common themes I hear from experienced players is that you should start out with mid range neutral and/or stable discs and not even really try to throw drivers for your first year or so.

I've been throwing primarily a Buzzz Z (166), and to a lesser extent an R Pro Roc (172) [by the way I know everyone hates the R Pro plastic, i picked it up at the store for cheap and I actually kind of like the way it feels].

Anyway, I have a lot more discs that I either found, were given, or bought myself, so I go and throw around on a soccer field a couple times a week to try to practice. I'd say most often I'm throwing somewhere in the 275-300' range.

Since I'm just a beginner, I've been trying to focus on using my Leopards (just cheap, 150's/DX plastic). The problem is that I turn them over nearly 100% of the time. I know the Leopard is a relatively understable disc, but I wonder if I just have bad form.

I'm tempted to think that I might be generating enough speed to step up to something bigger, but I'd rather learn how to throw right early on than screw myself up for life.

(FWIW, I also have a Champ Eagle that I found, and I seem to be able to throw it much more predictably... I also have a Valkyrie and Archon that I mess around with... I can get some throws in the 300-350' range, but I wouldn't really use them on the course)

KenTyburski 01-23-2013 06:53 PM

I'm sure a lot of people will chime in here, but a couple of things I notice...

1) Good that you are working with Buzzz, Roc, and Leopard. These are all good beginner discs that will end up teaching good form (my form is unconventional, but don't let that bother you on the advice front). The Eagle and Valk you mention are also good discs to start with. In my opinion, of course... The Valk is one of the first discs I threw, and I don't throw them anymore, but it was good for me at the beginning. The Z Buzzz will keep its flight characteristics longer than the Roc will because of the plastic, so I would suggest either getting a few of the same discs in each mold of cheaper plastic, or really work that Buzzz hard for form help.

2) If you are turning over your Leopard too much, there are a few things you can try.

First, lighter and DX plastic will flip/turnover sooner than heavier or more durable plastic. If you FELT comfy with a Leopard at one point, you can try them in Champ or Star plastic or go a little heavier. I have a Glow Champ Leopard that is pretty beat up, but it turns over in a way I want it to.. Love that disc! The "seasoning" period for better plastic is longer, so the discs will retain their flight characteristics longer than the DX or Pro plastics.

Second, if you are not doing it already, you could release the Leo with a little hyzer; that is, with your arm at an angle that is not level, with your hand closer to the ground. It doesn't have to be by much - a few degrees at most; the intent is to start the disc leaning this way -> / slightly so that it "flips up" to fly straight once it is in flight. I have a number of discs with which this is the norm.

However, my flippiest disc is a Latitude 64 Gold Line River. People swear by the River, and it GLIDES AND GLIDES when thrown right, but I turn it over way too much, which is why... Lastly, if you are turning the disc over every time, you might have what is referred to as OAT (off-axis torque). I probably do this enough, and would benefit from learning to get rid of it. That is, your wrist is rolling over during your motion and making the disc turn over faster, while it would not do so if your wrist stayed "on-axis" through your motion. You could try slowing your motion down and making sure that it is smooth. Don't try throwing at 100%, but more like 75-80% so that you can pay attention to each part of your form, and you may notice something.

If you have the ability to film yourself throwing, you might think about doing that and posting it here. Some of the members here are great at picking apart form through video (alas, I do not count myself among them).

Nothing beats practice, though. Keep working the kinks out, and good luck.

All you other people, feel free to chastise me for my advice to the new guy. :D

anborn 01-23-2013 07:01 PM

ditto everything Ken said above...

Also, every disc is slightly different, and no two discs (even of the same mold) will fly the same. There's a chance you've got a particularly understable leopard, when combined with the light weight, and hits taken from dx plastic, you might have beat it in well earlier than normal.

I'ld suggest grabbing another leopard dx (or even champ/star) in possibly a different weight to see how that flies for you.

you for sure on the right path and will be pushing that leopard out to 300+, and that valk to 350+ in no time. as for when the time to "step up" to a faster disc, there is no cutoff point, but you'll know. hell, if you're consistently getting the buzz/roc to 300 on the lines you choose, you may be there now.


MrDarkHorse 01-23-2013 07:55 PM

I actually had a guy from work take some video on my phone today. I can see about trying to figure out how to upload that. One thing I noticed for sure watching myself is that the nose is coming off too high, and I'm definitely not getting the kind of snap I see better players getting.

I just found out about towel drills yesterday, so I'll probably start trying that.

anborn mentioned getting another Leopard and trying that, and I actually already did. (which is why I have 2) My newer one is only moderately better. But more than any other disc I really feel like I have to try and compensate by adding hyzer to it when I throw it to keep it from flying left. (i use a LHBH)

I've heard other people mention "oating" before, and didn't understand what that was. I'll have to look into that, maybe that's what I'm doing.

I definitely have a tendency to keep the nose too high, and that's probably the biggest problem I know about.

Also, I've been really trying to work on the "starting the lawn mower" motion that so many people talk about, but I've found that I have a really difficult time adding any hyzer or anhyzer to my release while simultaneously doing a nice, sharp "snap" on my release. This is probably the thing about the release point that baffles me the most.

Psicko 01-23-2013 10:13 PM

I also have a 150g leopard. I flip it even when putting a lot of hyzer on it. I also have thrown a heavier star leopard about 169g, and I havent flipped it on accident. A leopard in the normal range should work for you.

MrDarkHorse 01-23-2013 11:58 PM

I think I'm going to get a cheap Comet and see how that goes. If I can't throw that strait, that should tell me if I'm doing something wrong.


sloppydisc 01-24-2013 12:27 AM

Yes. That'll be good for you. Then go watch Michael Johansen videos and see what a Comet can do!

thedrew300 01-24-2013 01:58 AM

When throwing a hyzer, it's helped me to bend at the waist in order to change the angle of release instead of changing my wrist angle. I just bend forward for a hyzer and back for an anhyzer. I keep the "starting the lawnmower" motion, but am still able to control my angle of release.

KenTyburski 01-24-2013 03:05 AM


Originally Posted by sloppydisc (Post 1807435)
Yes. That'll be good for you. Then go watch Michael Johansen videos and see what a Comet can do!

Yeah, that guy is pretty good. Or so I hear.

sidewinder22 01-24-2013 11:11 AM


Originally Posted by thedrew300 (Post 1807546)
When throwing a hyzer, it's helped me to bend at the waist in order to change the angle of release instead of changing my wrist angle. I just bend forward for a hyzer and back for an anhyzer. I keep the "starting the lawnmower" motion, but am still able to control my angle of release.

Bending should be from the hips, never from the waist.

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