#221  
Old 08-23-2019, 11:22 AM
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SuperWookie SuperWookie is offline
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Yes, I am a perfectionist in certain things, haha. It's extremely frustrating finding out that not only is there no easy way to find discs that you KNOW will go certain distances relative to your swing speed/distance, but that ALL the discs come out different! Flat top, semi flat, slight domey, domey, stiffer, more flexible, etc. And ALLL from the same mold and plastic! That's pathetic. Can you imagine if this was the case in golf or any other sport. People would be revolting and demanding this be fixed immediately. But it sounds like this is the norm in disc golf and everyone just has to buy a thousand discs and figure out which ones you like. I guess I need to realize all this about disc golf quickly and stop worrying about it. Just play the discs I have and add some here and there for shots I don't have already. Doesn't make any sense, but oh well, get used to it? Right?

I guess, what I'm really looking for now (since my bag is pretty much full), is 1-2 approach discs that just drop dead at a certain distance, and then 1-2 really good Forehand discs. I have a Berg I just got in the mail today for short approaches, now I need to find a mid that does the same, and possibly a fw or control driver speed disc that also throws like a lawn dart. So any suggestions there is appreciated. Something I can throw around 250' and it just drops like a dart. Then same thing for around 300'. Just for reference, with where I'm at distance wise. My mids go around 280-300 and my fw/control drivers go around 310-350 depending on the glide and disc.

Same for forehand. I NEVER throw FH on a course, as I can't for some weird reason. Every single FH I throw when I practice, wobbles out horribly and crashes right hard! I've had a few decent throws that go around 250-275 and somewhat where I aimed, but are so wobbly and just not flat at all! Some almost look like I was trying to throw a spike hyzer bomb or thumber they go so hard right and straight down into the ground. I have no idea how my FH is so bad. I can throw and do all other sports really well, so it's strange that my FH isn't good right away. I'm practicing here and there to get better at it.

But I think I already have 1 amazing FH disc in my bag, that I just found out is incredible for FH's. The Leo Piironen FD2 Royal Rage. And after picking it up to feel it out for a FH, I have to agree, it feels amazing for FH. So thin, so perfectly flat on top, and has that nice smooth straight sloping wing, no weird shapes. And is very smooth on all parts of the wing and rim. So then all I need is a speed 10 or 11 long distance FH disc that is VERY much like my FD2 as far as feel goes, but just for longer shots. Something that goes pretty straight, won't turn much left, and has a soft fade right. Something like a DD or PD maybe? I just found out yesterday that something that has a more flat shape on the wing is really good for FH, as well as being thinner overall and a flat top? Plus super stable plastic. So maybe a C line DD or PD? Or even an Axiom or MVP disc? It will also double as my only OS driving disc as well. Any suggestions are appreciated. Thanks for the info!
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  #222  
Old 08-23-2019, 05:22 PM
slowplastic slowplastic is offline
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Originally Posted by SuperWookie View Post
Arrrgggghhhhh, so frustrating. I just want discs that go different distances just like golf. I don't want to have to sort through hundreds of discs over my lifetime trying to find the perfect disc for every shot. I just want to know how far certain discs will go based on throwing around 400' max distance. I feel like it should be much easier to get that info and know aproximately how far discs go, if you know how far someone can throw.
I'll give you a rundown for myself, seeing as I throw that 400' golf line distance generally.

If I say a disc is stable I mean straight/neutral. If I say a disc is stable-OS that means neutral to fade, think like a Teebird. If I say OS then I mean truly beefy like a Firebird, the low-glide OS disc class. All discs are thrown flat if neutral and hyzer flip if they turn. Flex lines would be longer but there are more variables, so distances for stable-OS and OS could be longer on different lines.

Putters - US/stable/and stable-OS all go same distance, and that is 280'ish easy/300' harder

Putter-mid OS hybrid like a Zone/Harp - 275'ish

Mids - US/stable 330ish, stable-OS 320'ish. Pure OS like a Gator I don't know, likely well under 300' but it's been a while.

Fairways - US/stable/stable-OS - 350' easy 370' hard
OS with glide like a Thunderbird is 330' up to 350' hard.
True OS like Firebird is 300-320'. Some very OS FAF Firebirds are significantly shorter. So this is with my mids in distance.

Distance drivers - US/Stable/stable-OS 375-400+
True OS is 330-350'.

So you can see if I want to throw a pure hyzer at 330' through wind I need an OS distance driver. But if I want to throw a sweep hyzer in calm that glides as far left as possible at 330' I might throw a more neutral or stable-OS fairway, since it will stay afloat and get more left.

Different speed classes have different characteristics in wind and on the ground, but then when you go too OS you lose distance and the disc can lose a distance class or even more.

If you're looking to try out something in that OS utility range, then something like an FD3 is a good start. It's not as unmanageable as a Firebird but is still OS to skip and handle all wind. Fast enough to cut through wind and handle overhand shots, do skips and FH rollers, but not so beefy it'll fade out of your hand if you try to power it down. The PD is a fantastic FH laser disc, but can be quite power hungry for BH shots. Called the power driver for a reason.

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  #223  
Old 08-23-2019, 08:22 PM
UhhNegative UhhNegative is offline
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Originally Posted by SuperWookie View Post
Yes, I am a perfectionist in certain things, haha. It's extremely frustrating finding out that not only is there no easy way to find discs that you KNOW will go certain distances relative to your swing speed/distance, but that ALL the discs come out different! Flat top, semi flat, slight domey, domey, stiffer, more flexible, etc. And ALLL from the same mold and plastic! That's pathetic. Can you imagine if this was the case in golf or any other sport. People would be revolting and demanding this be fixed immediately. But it sounds like this is the norm in disc golf and everyone just has to buy a thousand discs and figure out which ones you like. I guess I need to realize all this about disc golf quickly and stop worrying about it. Just play the discs I have and add some here and there for shots I don't have already. Doesn't make any sense, but oh well, get used to it? Right?
But ball golf lines are boring. Yeah they can do a little shot shaping here and there, but nothing like a hyzer flip to turn to fade. It's probably not possible to fix as long as the discs are made out of plastic. There's not specific distances because discs fly a lot differently than golf balls. In ball golf you are essentially hitting a "hyzer" every time because you can hit it high and drop it consistently where you want. Hyzers are the easiest to range in disc golf because they fly predictably. But as soon as you get straighter shots and disc flip and anhyzer, it's much harder to range and has to just be learned by feel. And truly you should do the opposite of everyone, buy LESS discs and learn the ones you have. I'd take 3 discs I intimately know the flight of over 20 discs covering every stability that I've never thrown before.

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  #224  
Old 08-24-2019, 01:02 PM
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Thanks guys! That helps more. I think the more I look at all my discs, I already have more than I need. Maybe an FD3 or something like that MIGHT be needed. But I think I'll just play what I have and learn them well. And obviously work on throwing better. Went out yesterday and we had amazing weather! 75, cool breeze and sun. But I wasn't throwing that well for some reason. Timing felt a little wonky. Still, it's nice that I can go out now and throw and know what 60-75% of my throws will do. Getting less and less really horrible throws or really bad pulls. So that's good.

REALLY loving my new mids I picked up recently. Got a C line glow MD3 and an S line and they just BOMB for a mid! I can throw those things on a super repeatable slight hyzer line 270-300 ever single time now! Like almost never miss that throw! It's really fun. They are becoming my GO TO discs for almost any medium or longer throw. Also picked up a Moonshine Compass and it too is amazing! It fits perfect between my extremely neutral Star Mako3 and my more stable MD3's. It's very straight with a slight fade at the end every time. Haven't had it turn on me yet. So my mids are quickly becoming my favorite discs. I've got all the bases covered there.

And continue to LOVE my S line FD's! Just about my most comfortable discs in my bag. It's either dead straight or 5' of turn, with a super reliable tiny fade or medium fade at the end depending on the angle. Not liking my Royal Rage FD2 much yet. It's super overstable and low glide. I think I've only thrown that thing well a handful of throws. It goes low and left every time and just feels odd in my hand. Although I'm starting to practice FH's and it feels the best for that.

Also, just picked up a Neutron Ion, and that thing is putter driving city! So straight with a reliable tiny fade at the end. Almost as long as my mids!!!

As far as my form goes, I feel like I'm stuck again and not really improving. Had that nice big jump over the last few weeks that culminated in much longer throws, but now, the last few times I've gone out, it's the exact same results, NO increase in distance at all. I still feel like I'm missing some secret technique that isn't allowing me to really sling the disc. I still feel like I'm sort of strong arming it. And on throws where I really let the disc come in late to my chest before I try to fling it out, those throws are even worse. They seem like they might have more spin, but they kind of just float out there and then fall down. They're not very penetrating flights and the distance is quite a bit lower. Which is weird, because it feels like I'm doing more what I should be doing, but the results are worse.

I've had some great success by adding the X step hammer throw walk into my throw (just like SW's video). It cleaned things up a lot and added some much needed timing and balance. But now, it feels like in order to throw farther, I need more than that? I didn't film myself the last two times because nothing changed and I just didn't feel great throwing. But I'll try to get some more video up soon.
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  #225  
Old 08-25-2019, 11:36 AM
UhhNegative UhhNegative is offline
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I mean it takes years of practice to truly develop distance. It's very rare for someone to just come out of the gates throwing 500'.

One thing to try is trying to hold on to the disc tighter at release and see what that does for you. Whenever I think "ok grip the f%#$ out of this thing right at the end", I get a lot higher speed ejections. Like just clamp the ever living **** out of it. If your timing/positioning is wrong it will probably go way right, but if you properly setup the disc has no choice but to go where your body is aiming. Of course proper body positioning and timing is king, but if you can't effectively transfer all that energy to the disc (through the grip; ejection; hit point) then you are basically wasting power. Could just be something I struggle with though as I have small hands and relatively weak grip.




Last edited by UhhNegative; 08-25-2019 at 11:41 AM.
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  #226  
Old 08-25-2019, 07:00 PM
slowplastic slowplastic is offline
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Those are some good discs. I bag the Ion and Compass as that stable-OS putter and mid slot. Both have typical glide and amazing consistency. I also bag the FD as a stable/neutral but glidey fairway. I think the Mako3 and MD3 are both very good too but I don't own them. All of those are great for field work as you can throw them on any line.
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  #227  
Old 08-26-2019, 10:04 AM
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Those are some good discs. I bag the Ion and Compass as that stable-OS putter and mid slot. Both have typical glide and amazing consistency. I also bag the FD as a stable/neutral but glidey fairway. I think the Mako3 and MD3 are both very good too but I don't own them. All of those are great for field work as you can throw them on any line.
Thanks! Yeah, I have 4 total FD's that I bought for fieldwork months ago! They're my favorite disc to throw. Although those two MD3's are quickly catching up. Same with the Compass. I really like how heavy all 3 of those are and how they're a little larger than all the other discs! I really can feel the weight of them and it just helps me to whip them more. I can really huck that glow MD3 sometimes really far for a mid. Like it thinks it's a FW sometimes, haha!

I recently realized I need to get my mid game going, now that I'm actually playing more often on a course. I'm realizing that is where most of your shots come from. Plus all the approach shots. So I realized a few weeks ago, I needed to fill out my bag with more mids for practice and just to have different flight paths for those shots. So It's really helped me a lot having the choice of Mids to throw for different shots and holes! I used to just throw that Star Mako3, but it's so twitchy. I used to love it for field throwing, as I can really get a long throw out of it, and it turns a little before it comes back. But on the course, it's a little harder to trust since it goes wherever you throw it. It can go dead straight with the softest barely there fade. Or it can turn a little too much right if I throw it too hard or get even the slightest anhyzer angle on it.

Those MD3's and the Compass have given me 3 new mids to chose from that are so reliable and that I trust. And I'm starting to realize how important shaping shots is, over being able to just throw straight. I mean, I still want to learn how to throw straight really well, but at the same time, practicing hyzer throws of varrying angle is helping me get around trees on the course and throw the disc more like a dart, instead of it gliding or skipping way past where I wanted. Any hole in the 260-310 range, I just pull out the MD3 and rip on it with a hyzer and I'm near the basket pretty often. I think watching pros play a LOT more often now helps me see how important it is as well! I rarely watched pros play before the last week or so. I was only watching certain players, and just their drives. But now, every night before I go to bed, I watch a 9 hole segment of pros playing and it is amazing how few times they need or actually play a straight shot. It's usually only for easy approaches or certain drives. So that has helped me to realize throwing straight isn't as important as I thought it was, and how helpful a good hyzer shot can be!

I was going to ask you another disc suggestion question (or anyone that wants to chime in). If I'm looking for two discs that have a slight left to right turn the whole way for a Mid and a FW, what would you suggest? I have a Gold Line Fuse and a Gold Line Maul, but those now both turn SO hard on me, even on 75% power. They are useful for certain SUPER shots, but overall, they just turn so much, I can't trust them. If I throw them on a rope about 80% power and a little left, they turn almost immediately and never come back! The Maul can end up like 50-80' right of where I was aiming it. Mostly because of it's insane glide. It just never stops gliding, even when it appears to be done. The Fuse does the same, just not as far. Which is good for certain holes, but overall, they both turn too much to trust. And since I'm no where near being able to throw an Anhyzer yet, or very consistently, I'm looking for a mid and a speed 7-9 that can fill that role.

I was thinking maybe a Prodigy F5, or a Lat 64 Jade or River in Opto or Opto X? Or an MVP Amp or Switch in Neutron? Something along that line in a harder plastic, so it doesn't get too flippy or turn too much. Does switching from the exact same disc to it's harder plastic counterpart take off enough turn to make a noticeable difference? Make it so it doesn't turn so hard and for so long? Something that goes straight or barely turns, and then holds that line right. But doesn't go WAY right. Just like a soft 10-20'. Have you ever come across any mids or FW's like that? That is a disc I don't have right now and could REALLY use for those dog leg right holes, since I can't throw a good FH yet, nor can I anhyzer throw. Thanks
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  #228  
Old 08-26-2019, 10:34 AM
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SuperWookie SuperWookie is offline
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There is always better.

Flat and straight do not exist if you want to throw far efficiently. Nothing in the universe or nature moves straight or flat.

I wouldn't be content with your grip until you are throwing big d.
And back to my throwing, here is some photos of my grips that SW asked for

Power Grip


Power Grip


Normal thumb position for most shots


My modified fan grip I use for 300ish or less shots. Index and pinky in the rim, middle fingers on the plate
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  #229  
Old 08-26-2019, 11:44 AM
slowplastic slowplastic is offline
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I've never thrown a Maul, but the Fuse can be pretty understable but also pretty nice. It feels good in hand and has a ton of glide. Before recommending more discs, try the Fuse on a hyzer release to throw a hyzer flip turnover shot.

Basically it's nice to have a disc that turns over every single time without any doubt. It is the worst if a disc is usually straight but if you hit it slightly too hard or there's some minor wind it'll turn. If a disc turns over and never comes back but in a way that it doesn't cut roll on you, like flip so hard and land on its right edge and roll, then it's not too understable. What you can do is take advantage of its flippiness by releasing on mild to moderate hyzer. During the first part of its flight it'll flip up to flat, all while going straight. Then it'll have a little more turn and once the right wing is down it'll finally start drifting to the right, but it might be halfway through its flight before this happens. Then if it doesn't have any fade on it, it'll just keep drifting slightly right for the rest of its flight and land pretty flat.

So you can control how far right a disc that's moderately to quite understable goes by how much hyzer you start it with. It takes a while to learn this shot, it's an advanced line, but it lets you throw so very interesting lines without any fade and really control the disc's entire flight.

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  #230  
Old 08-26-2019, 12:35 PM
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I've never thrown a Maul, but the Fuse can be pretty understable but also pretty nice. It feels good in hand and has a ton of glide. Before recommending more discs, try the Fuse on a hyzer release to throw a hyzer flip turnover shot.

Basically it's nice to have a disc that turns over every single time without any doubt. It is the worst if a disc is usually straight but if you hit it slightly too hard or there's some minor wind it'll turn. If a disc turns over and never comes back but in a way that it doesn't cut roll on you, like flip so hard and land on its right edge and roll, then it's not too understable. What you can do is take advantage of its flippiness by releasing on mild to moderate hyzer. During the first part of its flight it'll flip up to flat, all while going straight. Then it'll have a little more turn and once the right wing is down it'll finally start drifting to the right, but it might be halfway through its flight before this happens. Then if it doesn't have any fade on it, it'll just keep drifting slightly right for the rest of its flight and land pretty flat.

So you can control how far right a disc that's moderately to quite understable goes by how much hyzer you start it with. It takes a while to learn this shot, it's an advanced line, but it lets you throw so very interesting lines without any fade and really control the disc's entire flight.
Oh wow! That is so cool! I had no idea it would do that! I'll have to try that with my Maul and Fuse during field work and see if it does that. Throw it on a slight hyzer and a little left. But so far, no matter how I throw it or the Fuse, they just go right almost immediately on a huge sweeping anhyzer and never come back at all! The maul can sometimes go 350 without even trying that hard to throw it far, and a whole football field width or farther right!!! It's kind of crazy. I literally used to throw that thing dead straight, but over the last month or so (because my disc speed is moving up), I can't keep it straight to save my life! I threw one Friday when I was out practicing 350ish and in the trees about 20' right of the edge of the sidelines at the football field! It was INSANE how far right it went, and just gliding the whole way left to right. It was kind of cool to see what I can do with it.

So I definitely need to try that hyzer flip throw and see how it reacts. I'm just worried that if I tried that on a course, I'd bungle it all up, as I play WAY worse on the course than in the field. I'm actually getting pretty decent in the field, but on the course, it's usually pretty bad. I just fall into all my old bad habits within 5 holes or so and start strong arming everything and pulling right. No matter how hard I try to just take it easy and think about my good habits I have been forming. I used to be that way with golf as well. I was basically a par shooter on the driving range. I would have shot around par I could hit so well. But put me on the course and it all fell apart. It wasn't until way later that I got comfortable on the course and played well. Hope that happens sometime soon with Disc.

Thanks for the tip! And if you or anyone has any recommendations for a disc like I was asking about, that would be really helpful. Thanks
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