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Old 11-11-2018, 09:22 PM
Gmtata01 Gmtata01 is offline
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Default Caiman Vs Mortar vs Rocx3

Has Anyone throw all 3? I currently throw all Roc3s for my mid shots for US to OS but need something for strong a headwinds and very os shots that my glow Roc3 can’t do. I’m . Wanting to see what others are using out of the 3. I’m wanting something I can throw for shots 300 and in. Thanks!!
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Old 11-11-2018, 10:38 PM
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tylerc tylerc is offline
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IMO the order of stability is (most overstable) Caiman, Mortar, RocX3 (least overstable). In the same order as well, the Caiman is the best for forehand. The Caiman is also the most shallow, it is not super thin, but it is slightly more shallow than a Rhyno but not as shallow as a Zone. The Caiman felt natural to throw forehand and backhand up to 275. I could push it further but have not attempted because of course limitations.. It will take a fair bit of power to get the Caiman to 300 but I don't know your power level. The Caiman does not feel anything like a Roc3, if that is something you want to get then I suggest you look into other companies.

Also IMO I see you bag a Zone already which is a pretty fast "putter" and I personally use mine for overstable midrange shots. Granted it does end a hair shorter, and I like my zones up to 300 normally.. I also highly suggest you try out the Quake instead of these 3 discs for this slot. Caiman is my choice of those 3, but Quake is my personal choice for that shot.
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Old 11-12-2018, 10:13 AM
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Lumberjack504 Lumberjack504 is offline
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If you want to keep the "roc" hand-feel, you could get a westside bard in premium plastic (TP or VIP), a Z wasp, or find a champ rancho roc (these are not the easiest to find). Also the Millennium Taurus may suit you in this slot.
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Old 11-12-2018, 10:21 AM
Gmtata01 Gmtata01 is offline
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are rancho rocs very os?
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Old 11-12-2018, 10:24 AM
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dysmike dysmike is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gmtata01 View Post
are rancho rocs very os?
OS, yes. Very OS, no.
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Old 11-12-2018, 10:47 AM
Gmtata01 Gmtata01 is offline
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Looking for a mid with very good Overstability. Had 15-20 mph winds and im looking for something that wont turn over but still has great glide, so the rocx3 came to mind at first but started to add the mortar and caiman. Not looking for a meat hook but something that is workable and reliable.
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Old 11-12-2018, 11:24 AM
smarkquart smarkquart is offline
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Have not thrown the RocX3, but I specifically had a competition between the Caiman and the 1.5 Mortar.

BACKGROUND: Way back in the day I was running a Verdict/ EMac Truth combo, thinking it would cover almost everything but the extreme stabilities. After a marathon overnight round playing with one disc - the Verdict - I discovered that the Verdict, with my power range, what I need it for, body motion, etc was actually what I needed out of the EMac Truth. So, I started looking for a slight overstable midrange that can handle mostly flat for 70-80% of the flight before consistently dumping hard into the ground. I tried stretching out the Harp, but that is not a good option once I get past 240 feet.

During the 2017 Am Worlds Flymart, I ended up picking out a 1.3 Frontline-X Mortar. It was expensive, but I immediately loved how it fit into the hand. First hole I tried it out, during that tournament nonetheless, I hit chains from 280. Next hole, I parked it. It was instantly my disc of choice. A few months later, it claimed an ace. But for whatever reason, I thought I could turn a profit and sold all three I had. Clearly I am having seller's remorse now.

During last winter and going into this year, I thought the Justice could hack it once I seasoned it in a lot. At the local 9 I was throwing it every chance I could, even on unrealistic lines and shots I would not attempt during league. However, there is no way I am going to beat that disc into what the Mortar used to be. I still use the Justice, and it served me incredibly well during the CCO tournament in August, but it will never lose the overstability I need to bridge where it is at now and the Verdict.

So, two months ago I picked up two Star Caimans - one Proto Star and one stock stamp. Normally I like to have six or more of a mold that I throw so I can cycle them through my everyday bag and my tournament bag. That way they can be similar in seasoning, and the process is slowed, because I play a lot of rounds at the local 9 where it is quiet enough where I can unload the bag on every hole. I do not want my everyday bag to be seasoned differently than my tournament set-up. So, I only picked up two Caimans, thinking I would use them every opportunity I had to season them in.

NOTE ON THE CAIMAN: While not as crazy overstable like the Justice, it has considerable more HSS than the Mortar. I cannot throw it flat without it immediately starting to drift left (rhbh). Even at power I cannot keep it flat. I do not need the aggressive anhyzer like the Justice, but I do need to give it something, or it is not going to outdistance my Harp. I like how the Caiman feels in my hand, but its lack of glide and having too much HSS kept it in the bag during serious rounds, and it is not getting the seasoning I was hoping it would. Someday, maybe after it is trashed, it might do what I want, but that is only if it somehow develops a glide.

NOTE ON THE MORTAR: Two days ago I picked up two Recon Mortars. In actuality, I was in the store and had two Anvils in my hand. I liked how they felt, and was willing to give them a try in place of the Caiman because the store did not have any Frontline-X Mortars in. Still, I gave the Recon a feel and was incredibly happy by how "silky" they felt in the hand. Not gummy, but not super stiff to the touch like normal translucent plastic. I cannot describe it better than silky or velvety. It is not gummy like GStar or Frontline-X. I like them a lot. These are the 1.5 run. I had them out on the course with some mild wind, so my expectations were not high, but I threw them like I expected them to fly a certain way. Instantly, they are exactly what I wanted out of the disc. Straight flight for 70-80% of the way and then a dumping fade that does not take them too far left. I have two now, and I immediately jumped online and ordered another one. My only fear is that the Recon will season too quickly, forcing me to buy several more to slow down the process through cycling. It should not, because it is Recon, but when a disc is so perfect out of the box, that is always my fear. Then again, I love discs out of the box versus having to wait a season or two to get them where I want when I need results now.

In the end, Mortar over the Caiman every time.

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Old 11-12-2018, 11:33 AM
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haier2 haier2 is offline
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If you like the hand feel of the Roc3 and are considering a champ Rancho Roc, I'd suggest the Millennium Taurus. The rim feels nearly identical to a Champ Roc3 (better than the plus rim Rocx3 IMO) and the flight is quite overstable. Taurus flies straight like a Roc with a big beefy fade/skip at the end and it seems to have a touch more HSS as well.

In a headwind I pull out one of my Taurus where I'd normally throw my Roc3. The first run Taurus were actually penned Roc-X.
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Old 11-12-2018, 06:54 PM
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SD86 SD86 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gmtata01 View Post
Looking for a mid with very good Overstability. Had 15-20 mph winds and im looking for something that wont turn over but still has great glide, so the rocx3 came to mind at first but started to add the mortar and caiman. Not looking for a meat hook but something that is workable and reliable.
Dunno about the other two, but I found the RocX3 to be disappointingly 'not all that overstable'. In heavy headwinds, I like putting with a Gator. I haven't tried a Caiman (yet) but I hear good things about it as a wind fighter.
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Old 11-18-2018, 10:20 AM
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DiscinFiend DiscinFiend is offline
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Get a Millennium Taurus. They’re literally a “RocX”. It a beefy version of the Rancho Roc. Just like the RocX3 is a beefy version of the Roc3. It’s even penned RX on the bottom of the disc. They have a bead and feel very similar to a Roc in the hand. They aren’t flat, just a nice moderate dome (like a good KC/DX Roc). They’re also cheaper than most USDGC Rocs. I think they have slightly more HSS and LSS than most USDGC Rocs and RocX3s. If you like the flat top feel of your Roc3s, the RocX3 would also be a good option as well.
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