#101  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:48 AM
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phrumphkin phrumphkin is offline
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I don't know how long Paul is going to be up for hanging around here with us, but at least for now, this forum is NO LONGER Milk-Toast!
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  #102  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:51 AM
PMcBeth PMcBeth is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finny View Post
Wow.

Do you think she was Innova's #1 female player?
Ever? I never saw Juliana or Des play when they were winning their titles but as far as I know she had the most talent.

Now? statistically yes she would be.
  #103  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:51 AM
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Three Putt Three Putt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DiscinFiend View Post
I agree

All I gotta say is one of best pros (if not the best pro ever) to ever play disc golf started posting on DGCR again. Please let's not piss him off/scare him away. Big Jerm said in a CCDG video (posted in the last 24 hours) that disc golf pros should avoid DGCR...
Lol...he never struck me as the kind of personality the DGCR crowd could scare.
  #104  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:51 AM
Vonbeezy1 Vonbeezy1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DiscinFiend View Post
I agree

All I gotta say is one of best pros (if not the best pro ever) to ever play disc golf started posting on DGCR again. Please let's not piss him off/scare him away.
This. Please 1000x over!
  #105  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:53 AM
PMcBeth PMcBeth is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DiscinFiend View Post
I agree

All I gotta say is one of best pros (if not the best pro ever) to ever play disc golf started posting on DGCR again. Please let's not piss him off/scare him away. Big Jerm said in a CCDG video (posted in the last 24 hours) that disc golf pros should avoid DGCR...
I've learned to not get my feelings hurt aka not read every message especially when salt is involved.
  #106  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:54 AM
Finny Finny is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PMcBeth View Post
Ever? I never saw Juliana or Des play when they were winning their titles but as far as I know she had the most talent.

Now? statistically yes she would be.
Take you out of this because, as I've said, you move the needle. And let's forget about past greats like Climo and Barry who don't tour full time.

Is it your position that Val, as the #1 female in Innova's team, should get less support than someone like Sexton?
  #107  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:54 AM
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Broken Shoulder Broken Shoulder is online now
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New idea. Let's disregard accomplishments and push Innova to throw all the monies at Holly and Andrew Zimmern. Promote like crazy.
  #108  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:55 AM
jeffsk jeffsk is offline
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Originally Posted by tdschrock1 View Post
I see 2 separate issues that are being tossed around in this thread:

First: Val left Innova and cited being 'denied honors'. I think this is a vague statement that some have say is $, others say are discs and in reality is probably something else or a combination of things.

Second: Folks are speaking about the state of women's disc golf. Opinions I see range from 'Women are the minority and less valuable to the sport' to the polar opposite. Val and her parents are actively involved in this area and I look forward to hearing her opinion.
I was thinking the same two points here, but in more general terms. It seems this discussion (and several others in recent weeks also) point at two efforts/ideas that are dependent on each other, yet neither is in a place all of us would love to see: Grow the sport vs. Grow the industry. Certainly one compliments the other and drives in a way, but as I think about it, it almost seems like a chicken and egg scenario.

Paul got free Adidas through a product sponsorship, Adidas had a huge uptick in product sales, Adidas got paid, Paul got kicks. Understandably this isn't great for Paul and he is looking for a more mutually beneficial sponsorship...but if I am Adidas I have already benefitted and am unlikely to see increased benefit with an introduction of financial terms. More importantly in this instance, I ask did the DG industry grow or did the sport grow as a result of the McBeth/Adidas product sponsorship? I would argue neither did, thereby there was little to no gain in the DG microchasm from this relationship with two heavy hitters.

I see a similar line in this Val thread. Val is amazing, she is my daughter's favorite player so I have a personal desire to see her succeed as I have seen first hand the impact she has had on my little girl, but I also recognize that my little girl isn't the norm. Val and other top women in the sport inspired my daughter to start playing (I did not) and my daughter got her friends to play. Cool, the sport grew by 4 young women which is awesome. But those 4 girls don't drive the industry. Without the industry backing sustainment is difficult (certainly difficult for touring men also, but again World Champ vs. Middling touring pro isn't apples to apples I don't think) and I don't think industry backs the female growth the way it does the men (Philo gets a shot on Sportscenter and he gets a Destroyer...but viewership=short-term game growth=quick monetary increase from X amount of people who went and bought a Destroyer as their 1st disc after seeing that shot...so kind of makes sense I suppose in a sad way).

I don't know, I clearly don't gave this all hashed out in my head and am rambling on a Friday night, apologies for that, but just seems like somewhere these two sides of the same coin that a game we love is dependent on for success are at odds with each other as the sport continues to move forward and progress beyond a niche base.
  #109  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:56 AM
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corin_brown corin_brown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PMcBeth View Post
If 1,000 fans bought a Val Disc and 10,000 fans bought a Finny disc, who has the higher $ value to a company?
There's more to it than that in the above hypothetical. Such as, what kind of disc were each given and what did each do to earn that disc from the company? What if Val was given the Tern and Finny was given the Colt? Would those sales units numbers be the same? Or was Finny given a disc that was already 10x as popular as Val's disc?

The only way to compare Val & Finny's relative value to a company, as you measure it, would be to give each of them a disc of equal popularity and see who moved more discs.

Why didn't Innova give Val the Tern instead of the TL & Starfire?

"We all know the answer."

Quote:
Originally Posted by PMcBeth View Post
We all know the answer but your responses contridict this.
Sorry to "contridict" the above assertion but you say you support Val's action then you say Innova did right by her? Kinda contradictory, no?
 

  #110  
Old 01-07-2017, 01:01 AM
PMcBeth PMcBeth is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finny View Post
Take you out of this because, as I've said, you move the needle. And let's forget about past greats like Climo and Barry who don't tour full time.

Is it your position that Val, as the #1 female in Innova's team, should get less support than someone like Sexton?
Let's take Val out of this and I ask you if Sexton is making enough because I KNOW you're listening to his commentary. He is arguably the best commentator in the sport but his $$$ is saying so. I think he should just quit now, there isn't the compensation for him to make a living talking about others.

You're argument is dead.
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