#41  
Old 12-26-2018, 03:12 PM
JC17393 JC17393 is offline
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Originally Posted by pauldst View Post
Assuming you meant most lucrative, are Junior, Amateur, and/or Masters more lucrative? Why?
From a TD/organizer perspective, pro events are definitely the least lucrative and therefore the least attractive to run. With amateur tournaments, the profit margins on player pack and prize merchandise afford organizers the opportunity to cover most if not all their costs, perhaps even have something left over at the end. There is no such margin to draw from at pro events, so you're immediately in the hole. Obviously you seek sponsorship to help with this, but it's less of an uphill battle to break even with amateurs.
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  #42  
Old 12-26-2018, 03:17 PM
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DavidSauls DavidSauls is offline
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Originally Posted by pauldst View Post
Assuming you meant most lucrative, are Junior, Amateur, and/or Masters more lucrative? Why?
I did mean most---darned edit window---and for the same reason that pros are a drag on smaller events. The TDs have to raise cash, which is paid out to the pros in cash. Whereas the Ams can be paid in merchandise, where there's a wholesale/retail margin.

Host Pro Worlds, and all that money's leaving town. Host Am Worlds, and if you can get local vendors, more of it stays.

There's also a theory, possibly true, that the younger folks competing at Pro Worlds are mostly on a shoestring, while the older players more likely to spend more locally---so better for getting sponsors. And I've heard from a few hosts that the amateurs were more grateful, in general, than the pros.

None of which is to knock the Pros. Just that, among the options for hosting, they're not as lucrative---except, perhaps, for prestige.

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  #43  
Old 12-26-2018, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Finny View Post
How many of the people voting down Mulligans have ever been to a major PGA tournament? All of those are held on wide open courses. You need wide open for spectators. The Masters looks all woodsy on tv, but it's not. Let alone the British Open, which is held on courses with fewer trees than the Emporia Country Club.

I understand that the hazards in ball golf are on the ground and not in the air like disc golf, but still. If you want people to watch in person, you can't be buried in the woods. Everyone prefers seclusion for playing, but that doesn't work for spectating.
I have been to several and the comparison is silly.....sorry. In 2017, the Phoenix Waste Management Open PGA event, had over 204.000 spectators on Saturday. If your point is, disc golf should play events on such an open course to accommodate over 2,004 (very generous) spectators, I think the concept does not hold water.

I think basing decisions on majors or large scale events should not really take spectators into consideration, beyond their safety and the safety of the players.
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  #44  
Old 12-26-2018, 04:35 PM
JC17393 JC17393 is offline
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I think basing decisions on majors or large scale events should not really take spectators into consideration, beyond their safety and the safety of the players.
I see where you're coming from, but if the major/large scale events want to grow, they're going to need spectators. Probably not on the scale of a PGA tournament, but being able to accommodate galleries in excess of 1000 folks should be a consideration. Maybe not a super high priority, but it absolutely does need to be part of the considerations when organizing big pro events.

That doesn't mean courses need to be wide open ball golf course style, but they can't be tightly wooded with next to no space for anyone but the players either.

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  #45  
Old 12-26-2018, 05:26 PM
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I would much rather just watch more wooded (and some moderately open) disc golf at home with delayed video coverage than watch golf course disc golf in person.

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  #46  
Old 12-26-2018, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by ru4por View Post
I have been to several and the comparison is silly.....sorry. In 2017, the Phoenix Waste Management Open PGA event, had over 204.000 spectators on Saturday. If your point is, disc golf should play events on such an open course to accommodate over 2,004 (very generous) spectators, I think the concept does not hold water.

I think basing decisions on majors or large scale events should not really take spectators into consideration, beyond their safety and the safety of the players.
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Originally Posted by JC17393 View Post
I see where you're coming from, but if the major/large scale events want to grow, they're going to need spectators. Probably not on the scale of a PGA tournament, but being able to accommodate galleries in excess of 1000 folks should be a consideration. Maybe not a super high priority, but it absolutely does need to be part of the considerations when organizing big pro events.

That doesn't mean courses need to be wide open ball golf course style, but they can't be tightly wooded with next to no space for anyone but the players either.
Exactly how I would have answered
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  #47  
Old 11-29-2019, 12:30 PM
Understable Understable is offline
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Originally Posted by crater77 View Post
The other course being played is called The Fort and it is no joke! Extremely difficult and beautiful wooded course. Very tight lines and long distances. I can’t wait to see what the top pros can do on that course. I can shoot under par at mulligans fairly easily but I’m yet to get under par at The Fort. My only concern in for spectating. It’s so tightly wooded I’m not sure where they will be allowed to view the action. It’s a beautiful piece of property. Has a lake that they will be throwing over multiple times, and a top of the world type shot as well.
Pros have not been kind to the Fort course. Tees are crammed close to baskets and some highly questionable fairway designs. Don’t believe me? Heck, go check the DGPT coverage from last year, commentators had serious concerns.

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  #48  
Old 11-29-2019, 12:51 PM
JC17393 JC17393 is offline
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Originally Posted by Understable View Post
Pros have not been kind to the Fort course. Tees are crammed close to baskets and some highly questionable fairway designs. Don’t believe me? Heck, go check the DGPT coverage from last year, commentators had serious concerns.
Didn't that tournament have flooding issues that forced them to re-arrange a few holes, including adding a couple temp holes, just for the weekend?
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  #49  
Old 11-29-2019, 03:08 PM
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Open courses can be designed to present some of the same challenges as wooded courses and still be open enough for spectators.
Watched the PCS Open this week and even though the course was mostly open, with wide vistas for viewing and spectating, the basket placements, tee placements, Mandos and OB's were designed to feel much tighter.
USDGC tries to do this as well, but IMHO, with somewhat less success.
Memorial lake course, even less so...

My point is that that it doesn't necessarily have to be one or the other, open or wooded.
A well designed open-type course should have similar challenges and risk-reward as a wooded course.
A well designed
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  #50  
Old 11-30-2019, 06:54 AM
Chains Bailey Chains Bailey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finny View Post
...Everyone prefers seclusion for playing, but that doesn't work for spectating.
I do not think the value of spectators is worth the loss of course quality.

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