Old 06-21-2021, 01:21 PM
kp_1024 kp_1024 is offline
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Default Opinion: Pay to Play is Not a Con

Time and time again, I see pay to play courses receiving flak in the cons section due to them being pay to play. Sometimes someone says, "It's a great course, I'm probably willing to pay $10 to play it." Other times, they say, "It's a mediocre course, no way should it cost $10 to play."

I think this is garbage. I'm not here to start the debate again over whether courses should cost money, but I don't think it should be listed as a con in course reviews. The fact that you have to pay to play is technically nothing new. Your time to get to the course, gas money, public transit fees, etc., cost and can vary from region to region, and thus course to course. Therefore, the course is basically completely separate from the cost to play the course, so I don't think they should be included in the cons section. If you want to discuss this in your reviews, I say put it in Other Thoughts where you can discuss whether the price is worth it, just like you can discuss other things that are related to the course but aren't actually part of it.

By this logic, a course that costs $1,000,000 to play could be given 5 stars, but I don't think that's a problem. After all, a course that good deserves it, even it nobody will ever play it. If such a course was free but was in an inaccessible part of Alaska and only playable three months every year, it would basically be the same issue: inconvenient/difficult to play, but still really good.
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Old 06-21-2021, 01:41 PM
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enragedmullet enragedmullet is offline
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For me p2p can be a con when the course is nothing special. That doesn't count bagging a course for the first time. For example, the Mobile, AL region has several courses, including one designed by Houck. None of them are p2p (except Chickasabogue, but that's a $1 entry fee to the park, not the course). If one of the middling courses in the area charged $5 whereas I could play a nicer (for whatever reason) course for free, I'm picking the free one all day.

That said, free courses can attract a subset of players that may not be the most desirable. I mean people who litter, are obnoxiously loud, don't follow etiquette, etc. So in that respect, the p2p aspect could be considered a pro, though it may come off as snobby to some.

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Old 06-21-2021, 01:43 PM
Surge5 Surge5 is offline
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Definitely true. Especially on those courses that are privately owned (Blue Ribbon Pines, Wilderness, etc.) that NEED money to afford the upkeep. Most of the time you get what you pay for since the owners/parks department put that money back into the course.

If you're willing to pay the money, then it's not a big enough con to be listed in cons. It is helpful to list it in Other Thoughts since the price have changed, but it's not a con.

Now, are there ball golf courses charging ridiculous amounts? Yes. But... if you're willing to pay it, that's on you, not the course.

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Old 06-21-2021, 01:54 PM
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DavidSauls DavidSauls is online now
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Just like everything else reviewers list as cons, P2P will matter to some readers, not to others. I may not care that a course has bad signage or mixed basket types; you may not care that the sound of highway traffic is omnipresent. P2P may not matter when you're traveling or playing a course once a month, but if you're an every-day player, it might be significant.

I've no problem with listing P2P as a con. I've a little problem with complaining about it, but just listing it -- for those readers who will care -- seems fair to me.

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Old 06-21-2021, 01:56 PM
biscoe biscoe is online now
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It is a Pro imo.

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Old 06-21-2021, 02:05 PM
Rastnav Rastnav is offline
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IDK, don't some people list "missing your line brings a strong risk of losing a disc" as a con? They might list "many interesting and challenging shots over water" in the pro section. Same with "few challenging holes or interesting lines" and "perfect for a beginner".

It's just a listing of a common consideration for why someone might choose not to play there. It's also good information to highlight as important, especially as someone might show up without the cash in their pocket if they don't know.

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Old 06-21-2021, 02:12 PM
autocrosscrx autocrosscrx is offline
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If I were reviewing a course, I'd list pay to play as a con. However, I might list things like upkeep and low foot traffic and a more educated and respectful fellow disc golfer out on course as a plus.

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Old 06-21-2021, 02:21 PM
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ElementZ ElementZ is offline
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I have no problem with it at all if it's a private property and needs the money for upkeep, as Surge wrote. My issue is when "public" courses on city parks require a permit to play, which is the case in Madison.
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Old 06-21-2021, 02:30 PM
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glassila glassila is offline
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While everyone agrees that things like litter, poor signage, thorns, poison ivy, bad tee pads are cons not everyone would agree about P2P.
If I play a P2P course that is not well maintained then I would list it as a con. If the course is well maintained then I wouldn't.

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Old 06-21-2021, 02:58 PM
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Horsman Horsman is offline
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Originally Posted by ElementZ View Post
I have no problem with it at all if it's a private property and needs the money for upkeep, as Surge wrote. My issue is when "public" courses on city parks require a permit to play, which is the case in Madison.
My issue in Milwaukee is that P2P doesnt keep the foot traffic down. All the courses have been packed everyday after work to the point where there are groups of 20+ on some holes. Its getting nuts out there.
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