#41  
Old 02-14-2019, 04:54 PM
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chevis chevis is offline
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Originally Posted by JTacoma03 View Post
... I just don't understand why people care, to that degree of specificity, about something to irrelevant.
things are relevant to those that care about those things.
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  #42  
Old 02-14-2019, 04:56 PM
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wolfmandragon wolfmandragon is offline
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Originally Posted by JTacoma03 View Post
An indoor distance record with no wind is equally as relevant to the overall game as an outdoor record with wind assistance.

I just don't get all the hubbub about whether it was wind assisted or not. I understand why it matters in track and field events, both symbolically and because the speed/distance records are taken during the same competition that medals are handed out.

Why people care in disc golf confuses me though, it has no relevance to the Tour, it's just for fun. I get that people care to know who can throw "objectively" the furthest out of pure curiosity. I just don't understand why people care, to that degree of specificity, about something to irrelevant.
By your logic, why have a distance record at all? Its not a big deal to me with whom has it, but rather how the environment affects the flight.

If I know that player x can throw y number of feet at sea level, 68 degrees, z humidity..... then when said player throws greater than this, I know that environmentals assisted the flight.

I love disc golf, not just for the competition, but also of seeing the physics of flight in action.
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  #43  
Old 02-14-2019, 05:29 PM
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JTacoma03 JTacoma03 is offline
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Originally Posted by chevis View Post
things are relevant to those that care about those things.
Totally, I just think that the argument for why wind-assisted is bad is taken out of context when applied to disc golf.

If it doesn't apply to the tour whatsoever, why worry about it?

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Originally Posted by wolfmandragon View Post
By your logic, why have a distance record at all? Its not a big deal to me with whom has it, but rather how the environment affects the flight.

If I know that player x can throw y number of feet at sea level, 68 degrees, z humidity..... then when said player throws greater than this, I know that environmentals assisted the flight.

I love disc golf, not just for the competition, but also of seeing the physics of flight in action.
Because a distance record represents what is possible, not what is consistently replicable IMO. That's why we differentiate in our lingo even in casual conversation, we say things like "course distance", etc.

I think it's way cooler to know that a disc CAN be thrown over 1000' by 2 people in the world right now, than to worry about "oh it SHOULD have been 900ft."

When people were circumnavigating the globe on the ocean for the first time, I doubt there were people who said, "Well if <INSERT OTHER SHIP/CREW> can't do it, it's not a REAL feat." Or, "Pshhh, tradewinds were too strong, you may have gotten to your destination a half-day quicker but you didnt' REALLY travel your route faster."

That's just my .02 - I think there's absolutely a point to having this contest. It's to show what's possible for humans, just not possible for you (and me, most likely). It just doesn't need to be overly regulated, keep it fun, it has nothing to do with the Tour itself. It'd be like complaining about the World Putting Champion not having to putt on one of every type of basket...the regulation outweighs the importance of the title.

Last edited by JTacoma03; 02-14-2019 at 05:32 PM.
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Old 02-14-2019, 05:46 PM
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hugheshilton hugheshilton is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTacoma03 View Post
An indoor distance record with no wind is equally as relevant to the overall game as an outdoor record with wind assistance.

I just don't get all the hubbub about whether it was wind assisted or not. I understand why it matters in track and field events, both symbolically and because the speed/distance records are taken during the same competition that medals are handed out.

Why people care in disc golf confuses me though, it has no relevance to the Tour, it's just for fun. I get that people care to know who can throw "objectively" the furthest out of pure curiosity. I just don't understand why people care, to that degree of specificity, about something to irrelevant.
Well obviously distance throwing is more of a track and field event and has no relevance to anyone's performance on a course. But people care about a lot of things that have no relevance to any disc golf tour. People care about the Super Bowl and the World Cup and the Olympics. We care about all sorts of weird things. Why can't we care about who throws a golf disc the furthest in actual controlled conditions?

The problem with an outdoor distance record is that it depends on the conditions at the moment of the throw just as much as it does the actual throw (well, maybe not "just as much" but it definitely can make the marginal difference between 2 equal throws). As soon as you get more than 30 feet off the ground, the wind gets a lot stronger (citation: https://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/10/science/10qna.html).

Quote:
"Generally, the higher you go, you lose what is called the friction layer, where friction with the surface of the earth itself slows the wind somewhat, Mr. Searles explained. This happens at 30 to 100 feet, depending on the terrain and vegetation.
If you get a good gust at the moment of a throw, it's going to carry the disc a lot further. The current record is sort of meaningless because of this, and yet players get signature discs because of it. People obviously care.
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  #45  
Old 02-14-2019, 05:51 PM
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hugheshilton hugheshilton is offline
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Originally Posted by JTacoma03 View Post
Because a distance record represents what is possible, not what is consistently replicable IMO. That's why we differentiate in our lingo even in casual conversation, we say things like "course distance", etc.

I think it's way cooler to know that a disc CAN be thrown over 1000' by 2 people in the world right now, than to worry about "oh it SHOULD have been 900ft."
By your logic, someone should hold the distance record for throwing a disc off the rim of the grand canyon. It would definitely go more than 1000 feet, who cares about how it was thrown or what assisted the throw? The point is that it's probably actually NOT possible for a human to throw over 1000 feet. But it would be nice to know what is possible if guys like Lizotte and Wiggins were participating in distance contests where wind wasn't a factor. It would still be fun, and I'll bet both of them could get more than 470 feet.

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Old 02-14-2019, 08:41 PM
Sethamphetamine Sethamphetamine is offline
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Just noticed the roller record. 3800 feet....
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Old 02-14-2019, 09:30 PM
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Jimb Jimb is offline
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Just noticed the roller record. 3800 feet....
Not impressed. I’ve had doinked putts roll that far away.

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Old 02-15-2019, 03:10 PM
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JTacoma03 JTacoma03 is offline
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Originally Posted by hugheshilton View Post
By your logic, someone should hold the distance record for throwing a disc off the rim of the grand canyon. It would definitely go more than 1000 feet, who cares about how it was thrown or what assisted the throw? The point is that it's probably actually NOT possible for a human to throw over 1000 feet. But it would be nice to know what is possible if guys like Lizotte and Wiggins were participating in distance contests where wind wasn't a factor. It would still be fun, and I'll bet both of them could get more than 470 feet.
I appreciate your points, but I don't think that's what my logic says at all.

I didn't push for 0 regulation, just saying that the regulation level of the side competition should be commensurate with how relevant the side competition's outcome is to the main competition's required skillset.

i.e. - a 100m sprint world record should be highly regulated because the correlation between the meaning of the record and the main competition (Track and Field -> Sprinting) is very high.

There's just not nearly as clean of a translation between 360 distance shots and game planning for a Tour event.

Look at Golf - "long drive competitions" right? They use drivers with extra long shafts, the equipment has evolved to meet the needs of the side competition, but I'll bet you can name 10x more PGA pros from their Tour performance than you can name long drive champions. I honestly can't name one of the latter off the top of my head.

Disc Golf is very similar. Simon is using a very specific run of OOP Blizzard Bosses, not PD2's (though I did watch him win a distance contest in Australia with his golf setup, he threw ~600' with a PD2).

I understand why people care about knowing who can throw the farthest, it's cool! My point is specific to discussing why people care about strictly regulating a competition that should just be for fun, given the low correlation to the "main" thing (i.e. my points above in this post).

FWIW I'm not trying to say "don't have an indoor competition" - I'm just saying it's not more relevant suddenly because you took the wind out. I do think it's cool to know who can throw that far indoors, where you don't have the unlimited skyspace to work with.
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Old 02-15-2019, 04:59 PM
Spectacledbear Spectacledbear is offline
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I might have the world record - i threw from the pulpit rock, that's like 2k feet. Just clever use of the environment.

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  #50  
Old 02-15-2019, 05:29 PM
Hyzflip10 Hyzflip10 is offline
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OK, I'm gonna Prerube y'all:

https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forum...ad.php?t=10349

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