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View Poll Results: Which of these best describes Hole 18 at the Utah Open?
A par 2 where 38% of throws are errors, and 1% of throws are hero throws. 6 25.00%
A par 3 where 24% of throws are errors, and 33% of throws are hero throws. 16 66.67%
A par 4 where 16% of throws are hero throws, and 23% are double heroes. 1 4.17%
A par 5 where 37% of throws are hero throws, and 21% are double heroes. 0 0%
A par 6 where 16% of throws are hero throws, and 62% are double heroes. 1 4.17%
Voters: 24. You may not vote on this poll

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  #3581  
Old 02-19-2019, 10:28 AM
tbonesocrul tbonesocrul is offline
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https://www.lvcdg.com/wp-content/upl...atsMinSize.pdf

With LVC approaching I was checking out the course and its changes. Nice to see some changes made to the holes based on past statistics and not just changing the pars of the holes.
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  #3582  
Old 02-20-2019, 12:50 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbonesocrul View Post
...
With LVC approaching I was checking out the course and its changes. Nice to see some changes made to the holes based on past statistics and not just changing the pars of the holes.
Yep. You can't improve the way a hole plays by only changing par. There's a ton of work behind those changes.
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  #3583  
Old 02-21-2019, 10:00 AM
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The USGA is still looking at rolling back the golf ball. Maybe Disc Golf should limit drivers to 7 speed ;-)
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  #3584  
Old 02-21-2019, 10:52 AM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Originally Posted by PMantle View Post
The USGA is still looking at rolling back the golf ball. Maybe Disc Golf should limit drivers to 7 speed ;-)
I'd rather see the minimum leading-edge radius be doubled to 3.2mm from 1.6mm to cut in half the amount of force a disc hits with.

Wait, how does this relate to par?
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  #3585  
Old 02-21-2019, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve West View Post

Wait, how does this relate to par?
Holes and courses are getting easier. Rather than adjust par, they want to roll back the ball. This is because par is what the designer says it is, not what any golfer may or may not score.
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  #3586  
Old 02-21-2019, 12:14 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PMantle View Post
... This is because par is what the designer says it is, not what any golfer may or may not score.
Simply because I am very reluctant to change a number, iron-clad logic proves that my real weight is still what I put on my driver's license when I was 16!
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  #3587  
Old 02-21-2019, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
Simply because I am very reluctant to change a number, iron-clad logic proves that my real weight is still what I put on my driver's license when I was 16!
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  #3588  
Old 02-22-2019, 11:59 AM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Par for MPO of 54 would have been more informative. Hole #16 is on the bubble of being a par 2, (even moreseo than #1) but it wouldn’t be worth the trouble to call it that.

It's just too bad the immutable laws of the universe (specifically: "golf doesn't usually do it") will not allow for this course to ever be called a par 54 course for future MPO events.

Even at par 54 or 53, it would still be a birdie-rich course with par being rated below 1000.

Par was perfect for FPO, using a 925-rated FPO player as the expert.

I ran an experiment where I used the MPO scores to calculate 925-rate par. The light blue chart. Note the par 3 on the 500-foot hole #11. For 925-rated FPO players, that hole is a solid par 4.

From now on, I’ll try to use only FPO scores to calculate FPO pars, when there are enough of them.

I wonder if something similar would happen for Am scores. Since nobody records those, we'll never know.

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  #3589  
Old 02-22-2019, 12:46 PM
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Hole 7 today listed as 432 ft par 4 is averaging 4.65 for FPO and is close to 1 penalty taken per player. Does this expected penalty raise the true par to an "easy" par 5?
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  #3590  
Old 02-22-2019, 02:20 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cgkdisc View Post
Hole 7 today listed as 432 ft par 4 is averaging 4.65 for FPO and is close to 1 penalty taken per player. Does this expected penalty raise the true par to an "easy" par 5?
No, but if there were no penalty throws, calculated par would be 3 for FPO.

Here are the histograms with and without penalties.


A lot of the penalties came in groups of 2 or 3 per player. The chance of going penalty-free was just about 50/50 for a 925 player. The average number of penalties for the 925 player was just under 1. So, we might not be at the point where we could say an expert would "expect" a penalty.

A related question is: Would errorless play be to just get all the distance you can and ignore the consequences, because there is so much OB that trying to avoid a penalty is not the smart strategy?
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