#51  
Old 01-21-2012, 07:37 PM
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Opti - some of your golf design ideas just don't stand up to good design practices, not just theory. I think part of the confusion here has to do with looking at the same hole from different skill levels. As a blue level player, I'll have several NAGS situations playing a gold level course. I don't dislike those opportunities because if I execute the NAGS, I typically don't lose ground to others at my level. But don't mistake those holes as good designs for my skill level.
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  #52  
Old 01-21-2012, 07:41 PM
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Chuck

(I'm not being sarcastic or demeaning here)
Can you define what a NAGS is
Can you identify what the problem is with aforementioned NAGS


I am in the camp that a hole or 2 that rewards a longer player and/or tempts a long putt or shot from from over 80 feet away is a good thing....doing away with NAGS seems to do away with these holes
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Old 01-21-2012, 07:58 PM
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It's a fundamental difference between distance and accuracy. While everyone at a skill level can sometimes hit the basket when it's at a distance most can reach, the farther the basket gets from the tee, the fewer players at that skill level can ever reach it, no matter how much they practice. In addition, those who can throw farther can throw the same distance with more rounded edge discs than others at their skill level who need wide rimmed drivers. So their accuracy is better. It's basically rubbing salt in the wound to actually include holes that primarily reward distance where maybe 5%-15% of a skill level can ever get within birdie range when most holes already reward those with power/distance.

Ball golf recognized this issue and they have specific hole length ranges suitable for par 3, 4 and 5 that avoid their version of NAGS (wedge shot range from the fairway). Their issue has been NAGS creeping into the game at the highest levels because the top guys hit into NAGS range on many par 4s that are now too short for the technology. Fortunately, because putting is tougher in ball golf, they still have to get real close with their wedge to snag a birdie. That's not the case in DG where players can have almost certainty getting down in 2 from our NAGS range.
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:03 PM
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Fair enough but I guess I think eliminating NAGS would take away some of the best decision making moments on a course
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by optidiscic View Post
Fair enough but I guess I think eliminating NAGS would take away some of the best decision making moments on a course
I thought NAGS dealt with places where there was no decision. Upshot/putt/walk to next tee.
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:14 PM
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I thought NAGS dealt with places where there was no decision. Upshot/putt/walk to next tee.
I guess thats the issue...I dont think I have a handle on what a NAGS is.....somehow I think it is something different for different people

We joke about one another at our course...we call anyone who lays up a Princess Lay Up....I am assuming a Nags is just a flat green with no obstacles or oob and no wind

I still think every course should have 1 of these holes even if they are weak....I think I birdied hole 12 at woodshed from a long putt (maybe it was a three but it was a long upshot putt) Made my round

I actually think none of the holes Ive designed are NAGS btw if anything they are quite the opposite
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Three Putt View Post
I thought NAGS dealt with places where there was no decision. Upshot/putt/walk to next tee.
That's it. Every once in a while I find myself far enough away from the basket that I have zero chance of putting it in, but close enough that I can toss the disc under the basket with no forethought or good form. That's "Not A Golf Shot", because there is no thinking, strategy, or challenge to my skill set.

I'm usually happy to be there, though. It provides a moment of relaxation.
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by optidiscic View Post
I guess thats the issue...I dont think I have a handle on what a NAGS is.....somehow I think it is something different for different people

We joke about one another at our course...we call anyone who lays up a Princess Lay Up....I am assuming a Nags is just a flat green with no obstacles or oob and no wind

I still think every course should have 1 of these holes even if they are weak....I think I birdied hole 12 at woodshed from a long putt (maybe it was a three but it was a long upshot putt) Made my round

I actually think none of the holes Ive designed are NAGS btw if anything they are quite the opposite
That's a very low percentage shot, though. It will happen from time to time, but realistically in what I see as a NAGS hole going for the long putt or laying up result in the same score the vast majority of the time.

A lot of it is a difference of perspective. Take for example a green with a drop-off behind it. I see that as something that makes you pick your spot (in front of the basket) and hit it because if you go long you are toast. You seem to see it as a hole that makes everybody lay up. So I like the hole and you don't.
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
That's it. Every once in a while I find myself far enough away from the basket that I have zero chance of putting it in, but close enough that I can toss the disc under the basket with no forethought or good form. That's "Not A Golf Shot", because there is no thinking, strategy, or challenge to my skill set.

I'm usually happy to be there, though. It provides a moment of relaxation.
and that can be good design IF you took a risk and/or executed a phenomenal shot to get there.
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Three Putt View Post
I thought NAGS dealt with places where there was no decision. Upshot/putt/walk to next tee.
Ditto. That's my understanding of the concept.
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