99% vs 1%

[wolfhaley]

Originally Posted by RoDeO

I keep getting further

From reality?

[autocrosscrx]

Originally Posted by SaROCaM

At around 1:50 Philo talks about throwing a Champ Roc from about 150' or so. But as discussed here in the thread, yeah, under certain circumstances people will disc up for a short throw.

A lot of people now bag some kind of overstable throwing putter for this shot.

Lots of talk about throwing putters for everything under 300' but also lots of pros doing the opposite. Philo with a Roc, or Sexton with a Firebird on a ~200' hole for example.

Yeah. Personally, I've found recent scoring improvements and a lot of it for me is discing up.

For instance, there is a hole that I frequently play. I don't know the listed distance but it is somewhere between 200 and 230. You throw through an initial gap out of the woods, then you have to finish left.

I can reach it with a Judge and most people tell you it is a putter shot. My problem with that is I have to throw sort of hard to get it there. If I throw it too hard, it doesn't finish left. And long and right is OB. If I throw it too soft or too low, I end up way short. And since I have to lean on it, I sometimes early release or grip lock.

My new throw is a Teebird. I just push it through the gap and let it work towards the basket. I'm not throwing hard, so the only mistake that I really make is releasing it a little late. But when I release late, I release on more hyzer, so the miss right works even harder to get to the pin.

[azplaya25]

I used to subscribe to the “throw a putter for everything under x distance “ mentality. Now I just throw whatever I’m confident in if scores matter, but work on throwing all sorts of different discs when practicing. In the shot you’re describing where you have to finish left, teebird makes sense. But what if you have to land flat and finish straight? Good to have that shot in your bag as well

[autocrosscrx]

Originally Posted by azplaya25

I used to subscribe to the “throw a putter for everything under x distance “ mentality. Now I just throw whatever I’m confident in if scores matter, but work on throwing all sorts of different discs when practicing. In the shot you’re describing where you have to finish left, teebird makes sense. But what if you have to land flat and finish straight? Good to have that shot in your bag as well

...then I throw something that I can land flat and finish straight.

What I'm finding, though, is there are a lot of times where the miss with a faster disc doesn't really put you in a worse position than the "smart play" of discing down. And you don't get a lot of people that give you that advice.

[UhhNegative]

Originally Posted by SaROCaM

At around 1:50 Philo talks about throwing a Champ Roc from about 150' or so. But as discussed here in the thread, yeah, under certain circumstances people will disc up for a short throw.

A lot of people now bag some kind of overstable throwing putter for this shot.

Lots of talk about throwing putters for everything under 300' but also lots of pros doing the opposite. Philo with a Roc, or Sexton with a Firebird on a ~200' hole for example.

I think a lot is going to come down to comfortability and the demands of the particular hole. It's no secret Philo loves throwing Rocs. And yeah, someone like Sexton is just so comfortable with the firebird he will throw it on shots that I think most would agree is not the "optimal" shot. But he's also a guy who barely bags a midrange and doesn't really forehand any putters (sometimes the dart), definitely not any OS putters, so its kind of his only shot if he wants something that will reliably dump and doesn't trust his BH as much. I remember Paul also throwing FH Destroyers on very short holes back in the day and its just because he loves throwing that disc so he feels the most confident throwing it.

[UhhNegative]

Originally Posted by autocrosscrx

Yeah. Personally, I've found recent scoring improvements and a lot of it for me is discing up.

For instance, there is a hole that I frequently play. I don't know the listed distance but it is somewhere between 200 and 230. You throw through an initial gap out of the woods, then you have to finish left.

I can reach it with a Judge and most people tell you it is a putter shot. My problem with that is I have to throw sort of hard to get it there. If I throw it too hard, it doesn't finish left. And long and right is OB. If I throw it too soft or too low, I end up way short. And since I have to lean on it, I sometimes early release or grip lock.

My new throw is a Teebird. I just push it through the gap and let it work towards the basket. I'm not throwing hard, so the only mistake that I really make is releasing it a little late. But when I release late, I release on more hyzer, so the miss right works even harder to get to the pin.

And I would say even better would be like an OS putter/mid, in theory. Sounds like the speed is less of the issue as much as the stability. But of course, whatever disc you put in your hand that gives you the most confidence will get the job done, is the right disc for the job at that time.

[autocrosscrx]

Originally Posted by UhhNegative

And I would say even better would be like an OS putter/mid, in theory. Sounds like the speed is less of the issue as much as the stability. But of course, whatever disc you put in your hand that gives you the most confidence will get the job done, is the right disc for the job at that time.

No, distance is the issue. The issue with throwing a putter in that particular hole is that I have to throw it hard enough that I sacrifice accuracy to get it there. And I still don't always get it there. Why not throw a disc that I can easily get there?

[azplaya25]

Originally Posted by autocrosscrx

...then I throw something that I can land flat and finish straight.

What I'm finding, though, is there are a lot of times where the miss with a faster disc doesn't really put you in a worse position than the "smart play" of discing down. And you don't get a lot of people that give you that advice.

Yeah it’s all hole dependent. I think discing down advice is intended to help people learn clean form and work on release angles. If your playing a competitive round, it’s all about throwing the shot you are most confident in. Barsby is a world champion and he throws eagles for pretty much everything 200 and out. He also has his eagles dialed in and can throw them dead straight and have them land flat.

[autocrosscrx]

Originally Posted by azplaya25

Yeah it’s all hole dependent. I think discing down advice is intended to help people learn clean form and work on release angles. If your playing a competitive round, it’s all about throwing the shot you are most confident in. Barsby is a world champion and he throws eagles for pretty much everything 200 and out. He also has his eagles dialed in and can throw them dead straight and have them land flat.

I agree with that as far as how it should work. And then sometimes you have these folks that might have 350-400 or more power, but they don't know where it is going. Or they are hitting trees because they need room to flex their discs or are landing in the fairway and skipping in the woods. And it makes sense for them to disc down to stay out of the woods and have a better time.

...but then you have people like my buddy. We'll play and throw in the field next to the course to warm up. And his game is about the same as mine. He can generally hit gaps and throw to spots and land in spots, but only has about 300 power. And he'll throw beat up Wraiths dead straight 300 feet. Then we get out to the course and we'll have something like an uphill 260 foot hole. I'll throw a Beast pin high and then he'll tell me it is a putter hole and leave a Wizard 70 feet short. And that happens on 5 or 6 holes every single time we've played. And he treats me like I'm cheating by throwing discs that I can get to the hole (or get closer to the hole) instead of the "right" shot.