#21  
Old 09-16-2013, 09:10 PM
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Golden Tuna Golden Tuna is offline
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In the beginning, they had stone cylinders buried next to the pins here to point in the direction of the next hole. But, as I mentioned above, there are multiple pin placements for almost every hole on all of our 18 hole courses. So, it takes a lot of coordination and stones to use that method. 1 sign on a tree or bench is more efficient these days. However, nothing is more efficient than an arrow on hole 1's tee sign pointing where to go once you've finished the hole.
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  #22  
Old 09-16-2013, 09:29 PM
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JeremyKShort JeremyKShort is offline
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Originally Posted by markmcc View Post
I agree and I'm always looking for the map. The last course I played had an old map for a previous 9-hole layout. There was a very large, faded map in a kiosk, so I took multiple pictures, photoshopped it together into a single map, and enhanced the hole numbers, disc paths, and distances on the map. Then I uploaded the entire thing up to the DGCR site for the next traveler that encounters the course.

Check it out: http://www.dgcoursereview.com/course...0/56ac2660.jpg

I may not be in a position to help with local course maintenance as I am passing through, but I'll upload new maps when needed.
I was about to mention seeing that at Enchanted Lands, then realized that was the course you were talking about. That course is a good example of signage gone bad, or missing. Old signs and numbers from the old 9 hole layout mixed with the current. Some holes very well marked, others not at all. Makes it very difficult to play the first time through. It took a hit on the rating due to this, and def got mentioned in my review. I forgot to take a pic of the sign, so it was difficult with the old 9 hole layout. Glad to see someone putting a new map up.
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  #23  
Old 09-16-2013, 09:32 PM
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DG_Before_Breakfast DG_Before_Breakfast is offline
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I'd always prefer better signage, but there is a certain element of adventure in printing out the map and trying to figure is out for yourself. You play the wrong holes and have a longer walk, but also feels kind of an accomplishment to explore the course. Sometimes you meet cool people as you wander about looking lost, sometimes not, or they aren't too cool
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  #24  
Old 09-16-2013, 09:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New013 View Post
UNC's course has this problem in a really bad way. If you read the reviews a lot of people underrate the course because of how confusing it can be. The baskets have the wrong numbers on them because the course has been redesigned so many times and if you don't know the layout you will definitely miss holes because in a few places you finish a hole and see the hole after the next one but not the next pad.

It's coupled by the fact there's all kinds of paths going everywhere in parts and they had to move 18 recently so the 18 to 1 walk is really long and if you're not a student you have to park and start on 8 or 9.

I've offered multiple times to put up signs or put the correct numbers on the baskets and every time I'm told it'll be done just be patient. So I'm done with offering, it'll either get fixed or it won't. I don't know how it is in other places but here it seems like if you try to make things better for a course you're met with contempt.
I'll back up this story. UNC is a shame. With loving care it could be a really nice course. Little bit of the light blue paint they probably have 8,000 gallons of on the old baskets, couple basket position tweaks, and some updated navigation and tee signs, and BAMM you have an exceptional course with good variety. What a waste.
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  #25  
Old 09-16-2013, 09:57 PM
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Signage is like the flower thing in the icing on top of the cake. Without the delicious sugary sweet flower, you've still got cake. I like cake.
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  #26  
Old 09-16-2013, 10:16 PM
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Cake is better, but crappy frosting can ruin the whole thing. Ever wander around for 15 minutes looking for a tee pad? Walk about 3 miles in the 95 degree sun? It sucks. Do it a few times during a round, and it can spoil some good holes.
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Old 09-16-2013, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markmcc View Post
So my question: How important do you feel accurate signs are on a DG course and to the DGCR rating? Is it important to you that your local course is "visitor friendly", or are satisfied with minimal/no signing as long as the local players get around ok?
I think it's a matter of degree. Some courses are easier to follow, without signs. Very basic signs---something with the hole number on the tee, and the hole number on the basket unless it's obvious, help an awful lot. Availability of maps will make up for poor signage.

It's not just locals vs. visitors either. Any course in the region that I've played 2 or 3 times, I'll hardly notice the signs. But it's quite true that for locals, signage can be the least important course issue, to the detriment of first-timers.

Personally, I'd list problems in the "cons" but not deduct from the rating, unless navigation was completely hopeless. Partly because, in considering the quality of a course, I'm thinking about all players who play there, and I suspect only a tiny percentage are playing it for the first time.

.....but then, there are courses with multiple pin placements that can't be seen from the tee, and no signs or systems for indicating where the basket is today. Ugh.
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  #28  
Old 09-16-2013, 10:32 PM
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HeavyCritters HeavyCritters is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unknown2no1 View Post
This is a huge pet peeve of mine because I find it incredibly frustrating when finding the next tee is a chore.
^This

Quote:
Originally Posted by sloppydisc View Post
Cake is better, but crappy frosting can ruin the whole thing. Ever wander around for 15 minutes looking for a tee pad? Walk about 3 miles in the 95 degree sun? It sucks. Do it a few times during a round, and it can spoil some good holes.
^And This

I have walked off of courses in the past because it was damn near impossible to find my way around. It takes all of the fun out of playing the round. Completely frustrating and unnecessary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stardoggy View Post
Maybe I'm just a superficial oaf, but for me it went from a 2.5 course to a 3.5 course, just because of the more professional feel of it.
I haven't reviewed a lot of courses, but good signage would definitely raise my review score.
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  #29  
Old 09-16-2013, 10:39 PM
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I travel around sometimes and try to check out new courses. Lack of signage or even better directions to the next tee is a real problem in a large number of courses. I absolutely agree with the op.

I noticed when trying new courses in Florida it was a real problem on several courses I played.
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  #30  
Old 09-16-2013, 10:48 PM
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mashnut mashnut is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeK View Post
Personally, I barely give any weight in my ratings to tee signs. But then, I'm a reviewer who doesn't believe it's fair to rate a course on just one round. I review a course mostly on the quality of its individual holes and how well the designer did.

Like it or not, signs are a huge percentage of a rating here at DGCReview. There are lots of reviews where a frustrated reviewer docks a course one or even a full two stars (discs) because they got lost. I don't think that's fair but it is reality.

A map is a wonderful tool. I wish that it was easier for newbies to locate the maps on the course pages here. I think instead of "Links/Files" tab, put a link on the course page directly to the map, like the link to the GPS coordinates. (I know it's one click instead of two...but it helps )

I don't think I've ever gotten lost on a new course when I had a good map.

You should be careful assuming how much the things people list in their reviews affect their rating. I always mention navigation, positive or negative, in the text of my review. I'll even devote a whole paragraph to it if it's especially good or bad. I think that's really important info for the people who actually use the reviews to decide what course to play. I frankly don't care if my review is helpful to the local who's played the course hundreds of times and doesn't need to read my review to know what it's like. All that said, it's rare that navigation affects my rating by even half a disc, it occasionally makes the difference on a course that I'm between two ratings anyway but otherwise it's not something I really rate on.

Also, I disagree that you can't fairly rate a course based on a single round. Like I said above, the traveling players who I'm writing my reviews for are also likely to only get one round on the course so my impression after that single round could be useful to them. I think it's also valuable to have reviews from folks who have seen the course in all seasons and conditions and who know the history, but if you only have that local perspective you're missing a lot of information.

Last edited by mashnut; 09-16-2013 at 10:50 PM.
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