#21  
Old 03-07-2019, 01:34 PM
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lyleoross lyleoross is offline
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Originally Posted by sidewinder22 View Post
I only carry one disc faster than a PD or RR, which is an old beat up 155g blizzard Boss. Faster discs are less shapable on throwing lines and much less forgiving of angle errors. Their swing weight is also much heavier which is why I like lighter weights.

I used to carry 150g Teebirds for max distance, those bomb when your technique is sound, but found it was limiting because of the ceiling height needed and wind pushing it around. 150g Firebirds and Banger GTs also go surprisingly far and fun to throw.
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Originally Posted by 2naphish View Post
this is also exactly what i found personally . i throw drives almost exclusively forehand so rim width is probably less of a factor than it is for backhand throwers. the key for me was finding the correct weight so i got the desired flight pattern and distance for MY throw.

i just turned 60 and a distance bomb for me is right at 320'. i can't throw a new 170+ Star Boss 200' before it meathooks on me. i can however throw a new domey 155 Star Boss 270'. same thing with my ESP Nukes but 159-161 is my sweet spot. seasoning only adds to the glide and distance. i now carry 3 Bosses, 2 Nukes and a Shryke that flies like a longer Roadrunner for me for most if not all drives over 200' on any given course. the funny thing is they fly just like the heavier weights do in the hands of a player with 400'+ power.

with the ease of extra distance i can compete with 80% of the players i run into so i wouldn't discourage any person who can control what they are throwing now from trying a high speed driver. you just have to match the disc to your arm.
I'm going to agree to a large extent. When I start getting up over the speed nine discs, it gets increasingly hard to get good results. But if you watch what the top pros do with the high-speed discs, it's throw them on big open holes where they annie flex or go high to get distance. They never use them for anything technical, that I see. And of course, I'm not talking forehand.

There is a distance difference, for me. I can get my 320 to 350 (I'm also almost 60) with Valks and the Beast and Orc just don't get me that much more. But a Destroyer, the right one, can get me up to 400 feet when everything is clicking. It can be a costly 400 feet, but still. The cost is so much that over the last year, I've pretty much given over on them. Most of my drives are wtih lesser discs.
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  #22  
Old 03-07-2019, 01:58 PM
slowplastic slowplastic is offline
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I dunno...yeah I can throw a RR probably as far as most 12+ speed discs but it certainly needs more height and there's no way I'm throwing it with any amount of headwind or left to right wind. And I don't throw as hard as SW so I can't laser a PD as far as I'd like, I can throw a Teebird as far or farther but it won't resist wind as well. So going up in speed to something like a milder Destroyer lets me get more than fairway distances with more wind resistance, as well as laserbeams under 10' high that carry way farther than a fairway would.

Of course with beefy high speed stuff yeah I'm way better off throwing a PD/Thunderbird since I'd throw it the same distance, it'd hold a hyzer still, and it won't skip/fade as much on me. Though if there's 15+MPH wind then that OS Destroyer makes sense again since it cuts through better and will still fade at the end, whereas a Thunderbird/PD becomes a very good straight disc.

Basically just be honest with yourself...does this disc give you a shot that you otherwise don't have? Then throw it. Can you throw a fairway almost as far in another situation and have way more control? Then throw that instead in that case.

I fully agree with high speed stuff not being as shapeable on different lines. I could get away with a few fairway drivers and throw them on all sorts of lines BH and FH, yet I bag many high speed drivers and throw them less often...because I feel like the subtleties in their stabilities really impacts what happens during the whole flight vs. throwing a fairway and having it hold my angles the whole flight. I may go a few rounds without throwing certain high speed discs, but when I need that stability combination it's necessary.
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  #23  
Old 03-11-2019, 10:24 AM
Twmccoy Twmccoy is offline
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I finally watched the youtube Destroyer video. Fairly informative. I've honestly never given much thought to rim configuration the way the guy who made the vid did. I always assumed Destroyer stability based more on dome height.

It really is shocking how much stability variance star Destroyers have. I've never seen a really flippy one, but I've definitely seen massive overstable ones. We're talking like 100' or more difference on max distance drives between them.

I think the Destroyers are coming out inconsistently for 2 different reasons:

Shoddy QC at Innova. They're cranking out Destroyers at a rapid rate and the overall quality of them is inconsistent. Using slightly different batches of plastic can have different results too.

More than 1 Destroyer mold. It seems there's evidence that Innova is molding Destroyers in multiple molds. Obviously the video touched on that and it probably comes as a surprise to no one. Still, you have to wonder at the ridiculous amount of rim variance.

Last edited by Twmccoy; 03-11-2019 at 10:27 AM.
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  #24  
Old 03-11-2019, 04:51 PM
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lyleoross lyleoross is offline
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Originally Posted by Twmccoy View Post
I finally watched the youtube Destroyer video. Fairly informative. I've honestly never given much thought to rim configuration the way the guy who made the vid did. I always assumed Destroyer stability based more on dome height.

It really is shocking how much stability variance star Destroyers have. I've never seen a really flippy one, but I've definitely seen massive overstable ones. We're talking like 100' or more difference on max distance drives between them.

I think the Destroyers are coming out inconsistently for 2 different reasons:

Shoddy QC at Innova. They're cranking out Destroyers at a rapid rate and the overall quality of them is inconsistent. Using slightly different batches of plastic can have different results too.

More than 1 Destroyer mold. It seems there's evidence that Innova is molding Destroyers in multiple molds. Obviously the video touched on that and it probably comes as a surprise to no one. Still, you have to wonder at the ridiculous amount of rim variance.
Quality control in the cooling process does impact final shape, the difference I saw in the wraith was huge. It also seems to be blizzard and Lite dependent. If you're inserting air into hot plastic and it expands or shrinks as the process goes from hot to cold, I can see huge variation in rim configuration happening. Even with straight up plastic I can see this happening. I suspect the molds are pretty exact, the computer driven lathes that cut molds are very x 100 accurate.
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Old 03-11-2019, 07:04 PM
Twmccoy Twmccoy is offline
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Originally Posted by lyleoross View Post
Quality control in the cooling process does impact final shape, the difference I saw in the wraith was huge. It also seems to be blizzard and Lite dependent. If you're inserting air into hot plastic and it expands or shrinks as the process goes from hot to cold, I can see huge variation in rim configuration happening. Even with straight up plastic I can see this happening. I suspect the molds are pretty exact, the computer driven lathes that cut molds are very x 100 accurate.
You could be right about the molds being made to exacting standards, but it seems Innova is making Destroyers from 2 distinctly different molds. The rim variances can't all be explained by plastic cooling or something else. The entire shape of the rim on some of the newer star Destroyers is different than on old ones. As the guy illustrates in the video, those discs fly vastly different from each other too.

It almost looks like Innova has gone slightly less stable with the Wysocki Destroyers. The only time you might not see that is if they had old unstamped McBeth era ones that they put the Wysocki stamp on.
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  #26  
Old 03-12-2019, 12:13 PM
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ODRB ODRB is offline
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PLH, people.
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  #27  
Old 03-12-2019, 12:15 PM
VLaForce2002 VLaForce2002 is offline
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Originally Posted by ODRB View Post
PLH, people.
It seems that the wing curve is just as much if not more influential based on the video.

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Old 03-12-2019, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by VLaForce2002 View Post
It seems that the wing curve is just as much if not more influential based on the video.
Well, the video never bothers to discuss PLH, actually. So the video actually doesn't speak to your point at all.

That said, I've thrown Destroyers for years. When I lose one, the first thing I do is go into my stacks to find a couple with a PLH between the two where there is now a hole in my bag. One of the few always works to fill that gap.

I agree that wing shape plays into it. It would have been interesting to see how wing shape correlated with PLH. But that video ignores PLH entirely, and I don't care enough to go through mine. Because I already know how to pick Destroyer on look and feel.

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  #29  
Old 03-24-2019, 02:57 PM
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thatdirtykid thatdirtykid is offline
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I would like to see him add PLH to his data. I imagine that wing shape and PLH in destroyers go hand in hand though.

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  #30  
Old 03-24-2019, 04:31 PM
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SD86 SD86 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lyleoross View Post
Quality control in the cooling process does impact final shape, the difference I saw in the wraith was huge. It also seems to be blizzard and Lite dependent. If you're inserting air into hot plastic and it expands or shrinks as the process goes from hot to cold, I can see huge variation in rim configuration happening. Even with straight up plastic I can see this happening. I suspect the molds are pretty exact, the computer driven lathes that cut molds are very x 100 accurate.
Agree in that the cooling is very much a factor, air bubbles notwithstanding. They make so many that there is bound to be batches that cool differently than others, depending upon the temperature of the room.

P.S. And it's the PLH that the cooling rate will affect, so yes, the PLH is the issue.
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