#1  
Old 06-27-2022, 10:45 AM
timothy42b timothy42b is offline
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Default Disc on roof again

On our home course there's a bathroom building on the path to the pin and it's not unusual to land on the roof.

It's not designated OB (maybe it should be).

It is above 2 meters, which would require relief and a penalty. You can't mark directly under it. If you took relief on line of play that adds a stroke to the penalty. But that might be fair.

It is a solid object, which could mean relief behind it, but given the size of the building it's going to be near impossible to throw the next shot much nearer the hole, so that amounts to a penalty.

We've been playing it as 2 meter rule, take relief anywhere sideways no closer to the hole. But I read the rule section today and 2 meter rule is not in effect unless announced, so now I'm confused, and not sure the sideways relief is legal either.

If the 2 meter rule were not observed, then I think the drop has to be on the line of play. If I land on the roof, back up far enough to throw a decent shot over it, is that optional relief and I'm throwing 3? or throw within a meter of the building and call it 2?
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  #2  
Old 06-27-2022, 11:04 AM
biscoe biscoe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothy42b View Post
On our home course there's a bathroom building on the path to the pin and it's not unusual to land on the roof.

It's not designated OB (maybe it should be).

It is above 2 meters, which would require relief and a penalty. You can't mark directly under it. If you took relief on line of play that adds a stroke to the penalty. But that might be fair.

It is a solid object, which could mean relief behind it, but given the size of the building it's going to be near impossible to throw the next shot much nearer the hole, so that amounts to a penalty.

We've been playing it as 2 meter rule, take relief anywhere sideways no closer to the hole. But I read the rule section today and 2 meter rule is not in effect unless announced, so now I'm confused, and not sure the sideways relief is legal either.

If the 2 meter rule were not observed, then I think the drop has to be on the line of play. If I land on the roof, back up far enough to throw a decent shot over it, is that optional relief and I'm throwing 3? or throw within a meter of the building and call it 2?
I would probably go with OB with a drop zone.

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Old 06-27-2022, 11:31 AM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothy42b View Post
On our home course there's a bathroom building on the path to the pin and it's not unusual to land on the roof. ...
Take that hole out of play.

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Old 06-27-2022, 11:40 AM
dmoore1998 dmoore1998 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothy42b View Post
On our home course there's a bathroom building on the path to the pin and it's not unusual to land on the roof.

It's not designated OB (maybe it should be).

It is above 2 meters, which would require relief and a penalty. You can't mark directly under it. If you took relief on line of play that adds a stroke to the penalty. But that might be fair.

It is a solid object, which could mean relief behind it, but given the size of the building it's going to be near impossible to throw the next shot much nearer the hole, so that amounts to a penalty.

We've been playing it as 2 meter rule, take relief anywhere sideways no closer to the hole. But I read the rule section today and 2 meter rule is not in effect unless announced, so now I'm confused, and not sure the sideways relief is legal either.

If the 2 meter rule were not observed, then I think the drop has to be on the line of play. If I land on the roof, back up far enough to throw a decent shot over it, is that optional relief and I'm throwing 3? or throw within a meter of the building and call it 2?
We have the same thing. Everyone here plays drop behind it within a meter and you're throwing 2.
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Old 06-27-2022, 12:04 PM
biscoe biscoe is offline
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Originally Posted by dmoore1998 View Post
We have the same thing. Everyone here plays drop behind it within a meter and you're throwing 2.
Essentially Relief Area for the relief area...

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Old 06-27-2022, 12:12 PM
dmoore1998 dmoore1998 is offline
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Originally Posted by biscoe View Post
Essentially Relief Area for the relief area...
Essentially yes, primarily because there's an overhang on the roof, it basically plays like a "drop zone" without having it actually marked out. Otherwise your only real plays are to turn around and drop your disc 3-6 feet behind you and then throw to get away from the overhang, or to lean way back and try to tomahawk it while leaning back on a downslope.
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Old 06-27-2022, 12:13 PM
BillFleming BillFleming is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothy42b View Post
It is above 2 meters, which would require relief and a penalty. You can't mark directly under it. If you took relief on line of play that adds a stroke to the penalty. But that might be fair.
The bolded part is wrong. There is no 'extra' penalty. It's covered in Relief from Obstacles....

803.02 Relief from Obstacles
Quote:
E. No penalty throw is added if optional relief is being taken following a penalty taken for a disc out-of-bounds or above two meters.
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Old 06-27-2022, 12:31 PM
timothy42b timothy42b is offline
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Originally Posted by BillFleming View Post
The bolded part is wrong. There is no 'extra' penalty. It's covered in Relief from Obstacles....

803.02 Relief from Obstacles
Ah, I missed that, thank you.

So whether I consider it as OB or 2 meter, I can take additional (optional) relief without additional penalty. But it has to be on line of play, unless we designate a drop zone.

My thinking was that if I throw from within 1 meter of the building there is no additional penalty, but if I take optional relief farther back (so I can throw over the roof) then I would have to add a stroke. But we don't stack penalties here. That's good, because if I throw from that close I'm pretty sure I'll need an extra shot to get near the pin.

Is there a limit if I back up on line of play? I can stand back 10 meters to make a decent shot?

Quote:
We have the same thing. Everyone here plays drop behind it within a meter and you're throwing 2.
So choices seem to be treat it as an obstacle, drop within a meter and throw 2, or treat it as OB or 2 M, take a penalty and back up to where you can throw well and throw 3. Probably in this case the score will be the same.

Either way I think the way we did it last time was wrong - took the penalty for 2 M but moved laterally no closer than the pin.

Last edited by timothy42b; 06-27-2022 at 12:36 PM.
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Old 06-27-2022, 01:17 PM
txmxer txmxer is offline
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Is there an option to modify the hole to avoid this issue?
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  #10  
Old 06-27-2022, 01:23 PM
BillFleming BillFleming is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothy42b View Post
Ah, I missed that, thank you.
It's easily missed. Even pros miss it. Check out round 2 back 9 of the 2022 Memorial. Hole 11, both Jenn Allen and Henna Blomroos end up OB, with a mando still to go around. Henna has to go first and 'apparently' wasn't aware of the rule, but Jenn was. Check out the video below and go to the 6:55 minute mark. Henna takes an awkward stance/throw and Jenn takes advantage of the rule.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQrajgX93uM

Quote:
So whether I consider it as OB or 2 meter, I can take additional (optional) relief without additional penalty. But it has to be on line of play, unless we designate a drop zone.

My thinking was that if I throw from within 1 meter of the building there is no additional penalty, but if I take optional relief farther back (so I can throw over the roof) then I would have to add a stroke. But we don't stack penalties here. That's good, because if I throw from that close I'm pretty sure I'll need an extra shot to get near the pin.

Is there a limit if I back up on line of play? I can stand back 10 meters to make a decent shot?
No limit.


Quote:
So choices seem to be treat it as an obstacle, drop within a meter and throw 2, or treat it as OB or 2 M, take a penalty and back up to where you can throw well and throw 3. Probably in this case the score will be the same.

Either way I think the way we did it last time was wrong - took the penalty for 2 M but moved laterally no closer than the pin.
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