#101  
Old 06-01-2017, 03:36 PM
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thrembo thrembo is offline
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The main thing is to be completely honest and upfront about who gets what. I don't care if you are running the tournament to buy groceries for your kids. Just let me know. Shady stuff scares people away. But yes: Pay your tournament directors. Help them and thank them and hold them dear.
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  #102  
Old 06-01-2017, 03:47 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Originally Posted by harr0140 View Post
...
Would you (or do you think the same amount of people) would attend a tournament where there is no player pack, there are no payouts, just trophies . . . merchandise can still be purchased of course but its not mandatorily included in the tourney entry....
Older players want no stuff. Not even trophies. We've got piles of tourney-stamped max weight discs we don't want to throw and other junk we won't use (like gaudy dri-fit shirts). If we want discs, we just buy them. The discs we actually want, not something someone else got a deal on.

We'll still sign up for high-cost, big payout tourneys, because even the highest entry fee is worth it for the pure experience. But, we'd rather see the money go to directly to the TD than add to the layers of useless discs in the trunk.

The only thing other than compensating the TD plus the costs of running the tournament would be to - maybe - pay a video team or photographer.

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  #103  
Old 06-01-2017, 03:50 PM
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ru4por ru4por is online now
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Originally Posted by harr0140 View Post
I completely agree . . . the market decides who gets paid what. Better TD's get better attendance which in turns provides a better experience for the players. Lesser attended events don't draw the people and its tough to draw any sponsorship.

I am not telling people they have to value me or people like me for their efforts. . . but I am glad I am appreciated by the people in my area. I know what its like when you are a TD that gets a bad rap and it isn't pretty.

Now here is another question that is related but a tangent off the main subject . . .

Would you (or do you think the same amount of people) would attend a tournament where there is no player pack, there are no payouts, just trophies . . . merchandise can still be purchased of course but its not mandatorily included in the tourney entry.

So let's say I charge $15 per person for a tourney and provide trophies dependent on attendance. You get nothing else included. What kind of turnout would there be for an event like that? I'd guess not so good even with the price being so low to accommodate more people of lesser means.

SO if the only way people get behind a tournament is if they get stuff . . . then why shouldn't they be willing to pay full retail price through their entry fees?


I've considered offering a tourney or two like that just to have an experiment.
Yup. But, I work all week to make money, and I make decisions on how I wish to spend my discretionary entertainment dollars. I will pay a couple hundred bucks for Mrs. ru4por and I to go down to see a Wings game. Many think that is outlandish, but it is a decision we make.

I play tournaments to enjoy myself. I don't need player pack stuff, I don't need trophies and I don't need money paid back to me for playing well. I realize others have different takes.

I play to challenge myself and for the love of the game. I play because the competition jazzes me. I play to meet new people and hang out with disc golf friends. Maybe my needs are simple.

Poor tournaments are defined by the preparation of the course, the competency of the tournament staff to run a quick, efficient and pleasurable event.

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  #104  
Old 06-01-2017, 04:10 PM
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jivey311 jivey311 is offline
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I just got into the TD game a few years ago. I only really have time to do 1 event a year, but we try to make it the biggest and best as we can be.

Generally our goal is to give close to 100% payouts to the players. All the park fees, PDGA fees, and other random park fees comes from Sponsors. Once all our fees are paid out, any other sponsor donations that come aboard gets added to the payout.

We also try to give a good value in player pack, for example, this year is a C-tier, and the pack is a $40ish value. DD disc, Shirt, Pint glass, and free lunch. (Again, not coming out of payouts. I fronted the $ myself, on the hopes of finding enough sponsors to cover the costs--and yes we are very close) I've never made any $ off events. I'd be happy about breaking even. The tough part about TDing, is all the upfront costs of the event with all the fees and merch for players packs.

And before anyone says anything about "Make the players pack smaller, so you can have more payout...." Our payout is pretty dang good! Even with all that extra stuff you get.

It's tough to please everyone, because you really could go either way with all the decisions. But in the end, we're just putting on a event that we'd like to play in. And make it feel like an event, not just an afternoon round with your buddies.

Right now TDing is a labor of love, but in the future I may quit running PDGA events and just do unsanctioned events, less costs, less stress = more time for family.
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  #105  
Old 06-01-2017, 08:41 PM
JC17393 JC17393 is offline
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Originally Posted by jivey311 View Post
The tough part about TDing, is all the upfront costs of the event with all the fees and merch for players packs.
Agreed. So often, when fronting for those things, you're left with extra stock at the end of the tournament (fewer players than expected, bought extra "just in case", etc). Either that eats away any potential profit from the retail mark-up of what is "sold" to player packs and/or payout, or it's a loss until the TD can sell off the remainder (which requires still more effort).

This is where I think having a flat fee built into the entries that is just for the TD can help matters. At the very least, it takes a bit of the pressure off of relying on high attendance in order to "break even" on anything that is spent upfront.
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  #106  
Old 06-02-2017, 12:17 AM
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harr0140 harr0140 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
Older players want no stuff. Not even trophies. We've got piles of tourney-stamped max weight discs we don't want to throw and other junk we won't use (like gaudy dri-fit shirts). If we want discs, we just buy them. The discs we actually want, not something someone else got a deal on.

We'll still sign up for high-cost, big payout tourneys, because even the highest entry fee is worth it for the pure experience. But, we'd rather see the money go to directly to the TD than add to the layers of useless discs in the trunk.

The only thing other than compensating the TD plus the costs of running the tournament would be to - maybe - pay a video team or photographer.
I can totally see that Steve. . . the sport and most events seems driven by the people who have only been playing for a couple years at the most. I might just throw a little kink into the way I run events and see how it all works out.

When a TD complains they cannot sell their discs at intended prices (because they are being undercut by a bunch of amateur players selling off their player packs for less than retail) . . . they only have themselves (and the way the events seem to be setup) to blame for forcing people to take a bunch of stuff they dont want and will ultimately try to resell to recoup their entry fee. This is a theory I have been wondering about for a while and i might have my answer. I didn't pull the trigger on it because a lot of people do like the player pack with a custom stamped disc regardless of what disc it is . . . but many do not care, they just turn it and sell it. I will test out 1 tournament this year if I am pull it off in the new format and see how it is received.
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  #107  
Old 06-02-2017, 12:18 AM
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Grayson Grayson is offline
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By all means they should get paid. I would prefer a flat fee system per event rather than a cut from the retail/wholesale plastic. Too many feel its "their business" and throw a deluge of cheapened events which ultimately taints the sport. It becomes more of how much plastic is moved than the quality of events. JMHO from viewing it too many times.

Last edited by Grayson; 06-02-2017 at 12:22 AM.
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  #108  
Old 06-02-2017, 01:25 PM
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BrotherDave BrotherDave is offline
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Maybe TDs should just put out a tip jar.

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  #109  
Old 06-02-2017, 01:32 PM
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ru4por ru4por is online now
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Maybe TDs should just put out a tip jar.
How am I gonna fit a six pack of tasty craft beer into a tip jar??

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  #110  
Old 06-02-2017, 01:33 PM
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How am I gonna fit a six pack of tasty craft beer into a tip jar??
Just see me at the car between rounds.


BroD:-------------->will direct tournaments (poorly) for booze

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