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Old 04-23-2017, 07:58 AM
JC17393 JC17393 is offline
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Default CTP question

Ran across something yesterday I can't recall seeing in my nearly 20 years of playing and running tournaments, so I'm curious if any one else has come across it and if so, how the TD handled it.

On the last hole of my first round yesterday, one of my cardmates parked his drive within inches of the pole, easily beating out the previously marked CTP. When he picked up the flag and went to add his name to it as the current holder, he noticed the oddity. As usual when you beat a CTP, you look to see who you beat out for it. This one said "Joe / Tom (tied)".

I've never seen someone try to claim a tie on a CTP before. Maybe I've just been fortunate enough to have never seen such a dead heat, but there's usually no exact method to measure in the first place so it's hard to know.

Obviously in this case it didn't matter since my cardmate beat both on the marker and held it through the end of the day, but it did get me thinking on how I would handle that as a TD if the tie had held up through the end of the round/tournament. Pretty sure the prize for this particular CTP was a single disc donated by another player, so not something that can be split between them nor something that can be doubled up without it costing someone more than they bargained (the donor, the TD, a vendor, etc).

Anybody out there have this happen or have a policy for if it does? I'm leaning toward saying that the first person to mark it gets priority and you have to outright beat their mark to take it away. But I'm open to arguments in other directions.
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Old 04-23-2017, 08:51 AM
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eric40817 eric40817 is offline
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If its not something that can be split, have them do a throw off. Tying someone isnt beating them, but a tie is a tie, its not a win. I think its most fair to have a decision made, so have a CTP throwoff. Set up a temp basket, or have them rethrow their CTP hole after the tournaments over.
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Old 04-23-2017, 08:59 AM
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Consult20 Consult20 is offline
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Haven't seen a tie either, but one way to minimize that chance is to include some nylon string/twine wrapped around the metal ctp flag stick, then you have an easy measuring device. 30' or so should do it.
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Old 04-23-2017, 09:02 AM
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Cgkdisc Cgkdisc is offline
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Suggest the TD tell the tied players to figure it out. If they wish to break the tie with a coin flip or two CTP throws apiece, that's their call. Maybe one player is willing to keep the disc and pay the other player half the value of the disc. It's their call and TD doesn't have to get in the middle other than suggesting some of these options if tied players (newbies) seem confused what to do.
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Old 04-23-2017, 09:45 AM
ILUVSMGS18 ILUVSMGS18 is offline
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I've seen ace pot throw off CTPs go into ties but never for first place. When playing a tournament you should always have a tape measure handy.
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Old 04-23-2017, 10:18 AM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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I've seen a tie. The winners split the cash.

We used a string to compare the distances twice and it was so close that it came out different both times. We even had to consider whether the front or the back of the wire holding the flag was the official mark. (It's the back, because that presumably was touching the very front of the disc when it was placed.)

If the prize is non-fungible, I would prefer there be a tie-breaker in place ahead of time. Letting the players work it out could possibly lead to bad feelings if the prize was precious.

I wouldn't like the rule that the first tied player wins. The players had no control over who played that hole first.

If all aces share the ace pool, why can't all CTPs? Two aces on the CTP hole would be a tie, why shouldn't the second one count?
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Old 04-23-2017, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
I've seen a tie. The winners split the cash.

We used a string to compare the distances twice and it was so close that it came out different both times. We even had to consider whether the front or the back of the wire holding the flag was the official mark. (It's the back, because that presumably was touching the very front of the disc when it was placed.)

If the prize is non-fungible, I would prefer there be a tie-breaker in place ahead of time. Letting the players work it out could possibly lead to bad feelings if the prize was precious.

I wouldn't like the rule that the first tied player wins. The players had no control over who played that hole first.

If all aces share the ace pool, why can't all CTPs? Two aces on the CTP hole would be a tie, why shouldn't the second one count?
All good points!

Side question: Have you ever heard of or seen someone marking their lie with a mini, and then marking their ctp lie at the FRONT of the mini? I actually witnessed this a couple years ago, the person claimed it was legal and appropriate. I knew it was BS since 1) minis are different sizes, and 2) it seemed sleazy at the least, and 3) nobody else was marking their ctp lies like that.
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Old 04-23-2017, 01:14 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Consult20 View Post
All good points!

Side question: Have you ever heard of or seen someone marking their lie with a mini, and then marking their ctp lie at the FRONT of the mini? I actually witnessed this a couple years ago, the person claimed it was legal and appropriate. I knew it was BS since 1) minis are different sizes, and 2) it seemed sleazy at the least, and 3) nobody else was marking their ctp lies like that.
Never saw that. In fact, I find it remarkable that everyone seems to agree on how a CTP is marked. Even first-timers. They just seem to understand that the front of the thrown disc is what counts. I guess the natural way to measure how "close" two things are, is to measure the gap between them.
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Old 04-23-2017, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
Never saw that. In fact, I find it remarkable that everyone seems to agree on how a CTP is marked. Even first-timers. They just seem to understand that the front of the thrown disc is what counts. I guess the natural way to measure how "close" two things are, is to measure the gap between them.
I agree, it's just simple logic and fairness.
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