#61  
Old 01-14-2020, 06:10 PM
JC17393 JC17393 is offline
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Originally Posted by kenjiac View Post
Disc Golf is not Ball golf. Why do we need to be trying to make our games more similar?
Is there a reason that changing the rule to allow for an out of bounds stance as long as the marker/lie is in-bounds shouldn't be considered? Or at least a reason that isn't an instinctive anti-ball golf reaction? Because to be more like ball golf really isn't the impetus of the hypothetical rule change...it's just a coincidental side effect.

I'm really only throwing it out there as food for thought.
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  #62  
Old 01-14-2020, 06:13 PM
Steve West Steve West is online now
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Originally Posted by krupicka View Post
When OB is defined by a physical object (like a fence), it might not be physically possible.
What if the fence was not OB and it still wasn't physically possible?
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Old 01-14-2020, 06:17 PM
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krupicka krupicka is offline
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What if the fence was not OB and it still wasn't physically possible?
Example: Water tower Hole at Lake Eureka. We gave 30cm of relief as if it was OB.
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Old 01-14-2020, 09:53 PM
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DavidSauls DavidSauls is offline
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Originally Posted by JC17393 View Post
Is there a reason that changing the rule to allow for an out of bounds stance as long as the marker/lie is in-bounds shouldn't be considered? Or at least a reason that isn't an instinctive anti-ball golf reaction? Because to be more like ball golf really isn't the impetus of the hypothetical rule change...it's just a coincidental side effect.

I'm really only throwing it out there as food for thought.
I'm a little curious as to why the rules ever required the stance to be inbounds, in the first place. It seems, somewhat like soccer, that the position of the disc could be all that mattered.

That said, OB comes in many designs---bodies of water, creeks, roads, pavement, fenced areas, ropes, and lines of flags, etc.. Some are more practical to take an OB stance in, than others. Perhaps the simplicity of having the same relief rule for all won out.
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Old 01-14-2020, 10:10 PM
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krupicka krupicka is offline
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I think some of it is practical, but some of it is a result of a decision on what is a valid stance made long before I started playing.

If you stop and watch new players play who have not really read the rules nor been taught them, many naturally get the idea that their foot should be where the disc was, but many also treat that as the only stance rule; they will often have a foot ahed of their lie. If the stance rule was only "you must have a supporting point on the lie", then the need to offer relief from OB for the most part goes away as a legal stance would almost always be possible (except for the occasional disc leaning on a fence)

Please note I am not saying we should change the stance rule, just thinking aloud about how some decisions in the rules affect others.

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  #66  
Old 01-14-2020, 10:29 PM
Steve West Steve West is online now
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Originally Posted by krupicka View Post
Example: Water tower Hole at Lake Eureka. We gave 30cm of relief as if it was OB.
I was thinking of whether it would be possible to prevent ever moving the lie closer to the hole.
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  #67  
Old 01-15-2020, 12:41 PM
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kenjiac kenjiac is offline
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Originally Posted by JC17393 View Post
Is there a reason that changing the rule to allow for an out of bounds stance as long as the marker/lie is in-bounds shouldn't be considered? Or at least a reason that isn't an instinctive anti-ball golf reaction? Because to be more like ball golf really isn't the impetus of the hypothetical rule change...it's just a coincidental side effect.

I'm really only throwing it out there as food for thought.
I don't want to stand in water. The rule now allows me to take a legal lie with out getting me feet wet.

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Old 01-15-2020, 04:43 PM
ToddL ToddL is offline
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Originally Posted by JC17393 View Post
What if, just hypothetically, you were allowed to stand OB so long as the lie itself was in-bounds? Like if relief from an OB line was reduced from a maximum of 1 meter to a maximum of 30 centimeters? Or take it a step further and as long as the marker itself was in-bounds, it doesn't matter if the lie or any other supporting point is in OB.

The last might be the closest we can come to how ball golf does it. Players can stand in a hazard (like water) so long as the ball itself isn't in it. What prevents us from doing the same, aside from the current rules?

I'm not really advocating for such a change, but I do know at least one PDGA staffer who once suggested to me that it be considered.
I would also agree that having a supporting point OB should be / could be legal. I don't care either way, but it might be easier to enforce if it wasn't a rule. All the guys who say "oh, I'll pick my back foot up before I release the disc" are probably underestimating how often they actually break the rules.
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Old 01-16-2020, 03:01 PM
araytx araytx is offline
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Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
I was thinking of whether it would be possible to prevent ever moving the lie closer to the hole.

I'm with the person who doesn't want to stand in water.

I am pretty sure that THESE days, there is more roped/marked/strung OB than when the rule was originally conceived.

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Originally Posted by ToddL View Post
I would also agree that having a supporting point OB should be / could be legal. I don't care either way, but it might be easier to enforce if it wasn't a rule. All the guys who say "oh, I'll pick my back foot up before I release the disc" are probably underestimating how often they actually break the rules.
None, if it's never been called on them.
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  #70  
Old 01-16-2020, 03:08 PM
araytx araytx is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JC17393 View Post
What if, just hypothetically, you were allowed to stand OB so long as the lie itself was in-bounds? Like if relief from an OB line was reduced from a maximum of 1 meter to a maximum of 30 centimeters? Or take it a step further and as long as the marker itself was in-bounds, it doesn't matter if the lie or any other supporting point is in OB.

The last might be the closest we can come to how ball golf does it. Players can stand in a hazard (like water) so long as the ball itself isn't in it. What prevents us from doing the same, aside from the current rules?

I'm not really advocating for such a change, but I do know at least one PDGA staffer who once suggested to me that it be considered.
You'd be putting restrictions on the course designer and/or TD, as well (which might be your objective here, I don't know). But the answer is because that water that is just OB might be at the bottom of a 25- or more -foot dropoff into a creek or pond or lake or river -- that may or may not be accessible.
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