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  #11  
Old 03-15-2018, 10:20 AM
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hugheshilton hugheshilton is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nenja View Post
When you thought physical laws worked untill you started throwing discs...
Aim is right though. As an example, MOST new Rocs I've thrown with a pop-top dome were less HSS than new Rocs with mild domes. This is not universally true though; I've thrown a couple Rocs with big domes that were also quite overstable. Thus, as a general rule, I don't buy Rocs with big domes, but I don't discount the fact that this rule doesn't always hold.

The same thing goes for most Teebirds I've thrown. Most of the domey ones were less stable. However, most of the domey ones ALSO had lower PLH so the dome may have had no effect at all; it's really hard to tell.

On the other hand, most domey Destroyers I've thrown were quite overstable. There again though, I've thrown a few flat Destroyers that were also very overstable, so the rule isn't universal.

Dome is just a by-product of the cooling process. It CAN definitely be the case that when the dome falls, the wing also falls (seems more common in drivers), but that's not always true. In Firebirds, flat is nearly always more overstable so the wing definitely doesn't fall along with the dome in that case.

From an aerodynamic perspective, more dome creates faster airflow over the top of the disc. This SHOULD create more lift and thus potentially more turn (or at least more glide when there is no turn). From a practical perspective, whether the dome actually creates turn depends a lot on shape of the rest of the wing and how high the wing is. The full package is important, and dome can't be considered in a vacuum.
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  #12  
Old 03-15-2018, 11:28 AM
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armiller armiller is offline
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I've been curious for more dome discussions and have thought about starting a thread like "Domes you like and domes you don't." There are certainly discs where I want at least a little dome on top, and where flatter (probably higher PLH, but not necessarily) versions seem glideless. For me, some examples include Z Buzzz, Star Beast, ESP Surge, Champ Katana, Z Crank. I don't like them super round on top, but I'd much rather they have a little dome than none. Katanas and Cranks, in particular, I like to feel before buying. My best Z Crank (may it rest in peace) was a relatively high PLH compared to most I've seen, but still had a nice round top. It wasn't flippy and had freakishly awesome glide. Katanas are the same, where too flat means it loses the mold's magic, and too domey means the disc might be too flippy to handle the power you want for max distance.

In short, I'd be hard pressed to argue that PLH and dome somehow provide different answers, but if I feel up a disc, you better believe I'm paying attention to dome in addition to PLH, maybe dome even a bit more for some molds.

I am curious about other golfers, though. In my experience it seems to be molds where I want glide, as mentioned above. Sure I like flat Zones and flat Firebirds, like the next guy. But some molds are just duds if PLH is too high or dome is too low. Which molds do you folks pay most attention to dome?
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  #13  
Old 03-15-2018, 11:45 AM
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It all depends on the mold. Generally for a disc a dome will pull the PLH higher.

Discs are not made very exactly, plastic is an unknown consistency, temperature is unknown, pressure, humidity, specific plastic type or quality, etc. Sometimes a disc will cool and make a big dome and low PLH. Usually though a big dome means high PLH.

PLH is always key. It determines glide, speed, and stability. PLH is always what to go back to. Dome can change the PLH significantly but plastic and manufacturing are much bigger factors (and cant be changed). High PLH means less glide, less speed, and more stability.
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Old 03-15-2018, 12:10 PM
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F. Howl F. Howl is offline
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Do you guys use "pop top" and "dome" interchangeably? I thought a pop top has the mold's usual PLH, but the flight plate has popped up, where a domed disc is a raised flightplate due to a lowered PLH.
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Old 03-15-2018, 12:21 PM
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GripEnemy GripEnemy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F. Howl View Post
Do you guys use "pop top" and "dome" interchangeably? I thought a pop top has the mold's usual PLH, but the flight plate has popped up, where a domed disc is a raised flightplate due to a lowered PLH.
Pop tops are very domey. Pressing on the dome with both thumbs will cause them to make a sound when the dome inverts (temporarily) into a puddle top. Another sound occurs when it returns to it's original domey self - think of those kids popper toy things.

A disc can be domey and not pop top.

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Old 03-15-2018, 12:31 PM
ian.w ian.w is offline
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I don’t have much to add to this thread other than this; I think it is important to clarify that when people talk about comparing PLH, that they mean comparing between discs of the same mold, and almost always same plastic. For example, it’s not going to tell you much comparing the parting line height of a destroyer to a teebird. Along those lines, comparing parting lines of a DX teebird, and Star teebird are similarly meaningless. Usually. I’m sure there are some exceptions to this statement. Previous posts have explained most scenarios far better than I can.
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  #17  
Old 03-15-2018, 02:20 PM
atison atison is offline
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Fully agree ian.w that PLH dictating stability should only be used in reference to another similar mold/plastic.
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  #18  
Old 03-15-2018, 02:32 PM
elmexdela elmexdela is offline
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domey discs are worse is a general consensus
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  #19  
Old 03-15-2018, 04:17 PM
slowplastic slowplastic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ian.w View Post
I don’t have much to add to this thread other than this; I think it is important to clarify that when people talk about comparing PLH, that they mean comparing between discs of the same mold, and almost always same plastic. For example, it’s not going to tell you much comparing the parting line height of a destroyer to a teebird. Along those lines, comparing parting lines of a DX teebird, and Star teebird are similarly meaningless. Usually. I’m sure there are some exceptions to this statement. Previous posts have explained most scenarios far better than I can.
I think within a mold you can compare PLH, across different plastics. That being said every DX disc I have thrown has had a lower PLH than the star/champ versions and has flown accordingly. The one instance that people give where DX was more OS was the earlier DX Thunderbirds...I have not thrown or examined one. That would be an interesting case to see what the PLH is like compared to star/champ. I bet PLH rules all, until the plastic wears in and way more variables are introduced.

But if you compare star/champ Firebirds, a flat star with high PLH will be more OS than a normal domed champ with regular PLH. If you go to a super domey star with low PLH it will be way more mellow. I think when discs are fresh-ish you can compare PLH between plastics of the same mold. Just in a lot of Innova molds Champ tends to have a higher wing. Or maybe it's that star has more variety run to run?

I agree with everyone about dome/PLH depending on a mold by mold generalization. I don't really know what to say with an "all else equal" comparison between same mold/plastic/PLH but different dome.

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  #20  
Old 03-15-2018, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by armiller View Post


I am curious about other golfers, though. In my experience it seems to be molds where I want glide, as mentioned above. Sure I like flat Zones and flat Firebirds, like the next guy. But some molds are just duds if PLH is too high or dome is too low. Which molds do you folks pay most attention to dome?
Flat Terns suck. Takes the main selling feature, glide, away. Pros are the worst about this. The only drivers I want to be flat to flatish are those I am always throwing into the wind. But even then, it's not required that they be flat. I have a somewhat domey Bio Giant that is a great into the wind driver.
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