#11  
Old 11-28-2019, 08:29 AM
Muddyboots Muddyboots is offline
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My understanding is that Prodigy is player owned, to some extent. So those folks def have leverage, even if it is a slightly different avenue. I actually respect that model, even if it is just a different carrot/incentive.
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  #12  
Old 11-30-2019, 10:58 AM
DiscFifty DiscFifty is online now
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We live in a world where the 18-30 year old is or will be the majority soon enough. (Yes, there's a reason for all the peeps running for potus telling us about all the free stuff you will get if you vote for them. lol..) So to get that leverage, the player has to be young enough to attract the younger crowd. Paul and Paige are still young enough, but I think they both understand that they are almost 30 and the time is...NOW. With that said...

I always thought Simon would be the guy with the most leverage. But it appears he's just happy being Simon, making enough to have bills paid while not putting the spotlight and pressure on himself to be the next Paul. I don't think he wants to be that guy by any means.

Eagle, imop has tried "everything" to become a social media influencer/star. I think he has the best chance to be the next Paul but he's going to have to "stabilize" his overall persona, like Paul has done, so people can get used to him which is important for long term branding imop. One he matures a bit more....mentally...I think the future of disc golf is in his hands and he will be able to write his own ticket.

Nikko - man..talk about a missed opportunity. He was right there with Paul the entire time. But due to image instability, immaturity on the course, etc, he became the guy we didn't mind watching, but certainly never wanted to be like. I think he also realizes "now's the time!! " so he seems to have mellowed out a bit, has a new sponsorship, etc. Will be interesting to see how 2020 plays out for him. Like I said before.. dude has the look for marketing. I could see a line of clothes before a line of discs with his name on it.

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  #13  
Old 11-30-2019, 11:26 PM
elmexdela elmexdela is offline
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Originally Posted by DiscFifty View Post
We live in a world where the 18-30 year old is or will be the majority soon enough. (Yes, there's a reason for all the peeps running for potus telling us about all the free stuff you will get if you vote for them. lol..) So to get that leverage, the player has to be young enough to attract the younger crowd. Paul and Paige are still young enough, but I think they both understand that they are almost 30 and the time is...NOW. With that said...

I always thought Simon would be the guy with the most leverage. But it appears he's just happy being Simon, making enough to have bills paid while not putting the spotlight and pressure on himself to be the next Paul. I don't think he wants to be that guy by any means.

Eagle, imop has tried "everything" to become a social media influencer/star. I think he has the best chance to be the next Paul but he's going to have to "stabilize" his overall persona, like Paul has done, so people can get used to him which is important for long term branding imop. One he matures a bit more....mentally...I think the future of disc golf is in his hands and he will be able to write his own ticket.

Nikko - man..talk about a missed opportunity. He was right there with Paul the entire time. But due to image instability, immaturity on the course, etc, he became the guy we didn't mind watching, but certainly never wanted to be like. I think he also realizes "now's the time!! " so he seems to have mellowed out a bit, has a new sponsorship, etc. Will be interesting to see how 2020 plays out for him. Like I said before.. dude has the look for marketing. I could see a line of clothes before a line of discs with his name on it.
nikko is the most entertaining person to watch however i do not want to play like nikko on the course

i do appreciate nikko showing human emotions where as a lot of athletes try to keep this stoic front which seems to take away from the human experience
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  #14  
Old 12-01-2019, 06:12 PM
Chains Bailey Chains Bailey is offline
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Eagle, Nikko and Simon are definitely big time, but still do not hold the level of leverage that PMcBeth does.

The ability to dictate terms to a very high degree, and or over, a sponsor.

I still only see one.
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  #15  
Old 12-01-2019, 06:17 PM
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Cgkdisc Cgkdisc is offline
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No top player in any sport can dictate, just simply request. Some can request and get more than others. The economics of the sport and the companies supporting it determine the maximum request that can be granted without over-reaching and risking financial failure.

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Old 12-01-2019, 06:47 PM
Chains Bailey Chains Bailey is offline
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No top player in any sport can dictate, just simply request. Some can request and get more than others. The economics of the sport and the companies supporting it determine the maximum request that can be granted without over-reaching and risking financial failure.
True - the players can only request and there are common sense limits on what they can request. We have to assume that the players are aware of the basic ceiling available and would not request in an ignorant fashion.

I would say I am looking at the ability to request in favor of the player themselves to an extreme degree, bordering on the appearance of dictating terms. I am not ready to let go of the term dictating just yet, I am sure you may convince me otherwise.

If players A, B and C walk into a sponsor and demand X,Y and Z, I only see one player having their demands met. Add that the demands heavily favor the player, create an immediate large financial loss for the sponsor and are uncharted territory in the sport.

Maybe there is an argument that a player with PMcBeth's leverage could dictate terms with smaller companies? What do you think Cgkdisc?
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Old 12-01-2019, 07:02 PM
Chains Bailey Chains Bailey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cgkdisc View Post
No top player in any sport can dictate, just simply request. Some can request and get more than others. The economics of the sport and the companies supporting it determine the maximum request that can be granted without over-reaching and risking financial failure.
HA!

You are wrong buddy...

dictate
[dictate]
say or read aloud (words to be typed, written down, or recorded on tape)

ANY player could dictate terms - I win!

Definition number two comes to the rescue.
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  #18  
Old 12-01-2019, 07:36 PM
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Cgkdisc Cgkdisc is offline
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We agree that some players have more leverage than others. McBeth likely has more than any player currently with manufacturers whose core or major marketing plan relies on high profile players to move product. But your premise was that McBeth may have sufficient leverage to essentially force a better deal than is financially sound for the manufacturer. A firm on shakier financial ground might go for it and maybe they should include ownership shares as part of the deal so the player bears sufficient risk in making the deal work. A well managed firm should know their numbers well enough to have an idea what they can risk or afford. It's not always a specific dollar cap but more of a combination of guaranteed money along with a percentage of sales the player generates into the future.

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Old 12-01-2019, 07:59 PM
Chains Bailey Chains Bailey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cgkdisc View Post
But your premise was that McBeth may have sufficient leverage to essentially force a better deal than is financially sound for the manufacturer.
This.

I think the risk taken by Discraft does constitute "a better deal than is financially sound for the manufacturer".

I am sure they have an idea of what might happen, but I would argue they do not know for sure, therefore the leverage PMcBeth held was over the company's immediate best interests. I realize that there is short-term verse long-term interests, but I still think only one player can demand terms and have them met.

If his demands are not met, he can find another company willing to meet them - that equals leverage over a sponsor to me.

I could be wrong or looking at things in too simple of terms, but for this discussion maybe the less nuanced is best suited.


I agree that dictate is too strong of a word - I think demand may be a better fit in the context of my premise.
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  #20  
Old 12-02-2019, 12:00 AM
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hiflyer hiflyer is offline
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I believe the word we are looking for is "clout"
According to the Google search

2. INFORMAL
influence or power, especially in politics or business.
"I knew he carried a lot of clout"

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