#51  
Old 03-23-2020, 02:13 AM
Jomb3 Jomb3 is offline
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Have you tried an Electron Entropy yet?
No I haven't. Our store here in Finland doesn't sell it yet. Now I have to try that too! 😅
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  #52  
Old 03-23-2020, 02:11 PM
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aphilso1 aphilso1 is offline
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I bagged a Zone, Eclipse Envy, and Neutron Proxy for most of last season as my throwing putters. I didn't see that as too much overlap. Envy flies just like a Proxy with more fade, and hand feel is nearly identical.

I overhauled my putters this winter, as I wanted to try bagging slower putters that would work for me for both putting and throwing. I now pair Judges with my Zones, and my short game has improved as a result. The only problem I have is trying to mimic an Envy flight...my Jawbreaker Zone just stubbornly won't beat into an Envy flight, and even the most stable Judge (Lucid-X) still isn't quite as stable. It's a small gap that I don't notice most rounds , but every once in a while I find myself missing the ol' Envy.
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  #53  
Old 03-23-2020, 08:17 PM
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ThrowaEnvy ThrowaEnvy is online now
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Originally Posted by aphilso1 View Post
I bagged a Zone, Eclipse Envy, and Neutron Proxy for most of last season as my throwing putters. I didn't see that as too much overlap. Envy flies just like a Proxy with more fade, and hand feel is nearly identical.

I overhauled my putters this winter, as I wanted to try bagging slower putters that would work for me for both putting and throwing. I now pair Judges with my Zones, and my short game has improved as a result. The only problem I have is trying to mimic an Envy flight...my Jawbreaker Zone just stubbornly won't beat into an Envy flight, and even the most stable Judge (Lucid-X) still isn't quite as stable. It's a small gap that I don't notice most rounds , but every once in a while I find myself missing the ol' Envy.
Sounds like an Envy is in order.. I know what you mean with overlap, I struggle with that constantly.. The trick for me is the same weight, its one more variable to not deal with.

Pick your bag anchors, the rest will change... in and out, kinda like dating in a small community

"You don't lose your girlfriend, you just lose your turn"
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  #54  
Old 03-24-2020, 03:05 AM
FinHatch FinHatch is offline
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Did some more testing on the field last evening, my old&worn plasma Envy was pretty similar to the Proxy but the new’ish soft neutron was definetly more noticeably stable so that Envy’s staying, right between neutral Proxy and overstable Zone.

When will I use the Envy? Windy Proxy situations mostly probably
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  #55  
Old 03-24-2020, 09:59 AM
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Alexplz Alexplz is offline
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Originally Posted by aphilso1 View Post
I bagged a Zone, Eclipse Envy, and Neutron Proxy for most of last season as my throwing putters. I didn't see that as too much overlap. Envy flies just like a Proxy with more fade, and hand feel is nearly identical.

I overhauled my putters this winter, as I wanted to try bagging slower putters that would work for me for both putting and throwing. I now pair Judges with my Zones, and my short game has improved as a result. The only problem I have is trying to mimic an Envy flight...my Jawbreaker Zone just stubbornly won't beat into an Envy flight, and even the most stable Judge (Lucid-X) still isn't quite as stable. It's a small gap that I don't notice most rounds , but every once in a while I find myself missing the ol' Envy.
I went through a similar issue when I used to putt and throw Judges - I could not find a Judge that was significantly more stable than a fresh classic or prime. Tried Fuzion, Lucid, even Fluid.

Interesting to hear about the JB Zone - I have been considering beating in a Zone to get it to fly a little less stable on touch forehands, sounds like they stubbornly stay stable.
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  #56  
Old 03-24-2020, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by FinHatch View Post
Did some more testing on the field last evening, my old&worn plasma Envy was pretty similar to the Proxy but the new’ish soft neutron was definetly more noticeably stable so that Envy’s staying, right between neutral Proxy and overstable Zone.

When will I use the Envy? Windy Proxy situations mostly probably
I had a Plasma Envy that was incredibly neutral, almost proxy-like.

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  #57  
Old 03-24-2020, 11:13 AM
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aphilso1 aphilso1 is offline
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Originally Posted by Alexplz View Post
I went through a similar issue when I used to putt and throw Judges - I could not find a Judge that was significantly more stable than a fresh classic or prime. Tried Fuzion, Lucid, even Fluid.

Interesting to hear about the JB Zone - I have been considering beating in a Zone to get it to fly a little less stable on touch forehands, sounds like they stubbornly stay stable.
I always found Trilogy molds actually fly more stable in fresh prime plastic compared to their premium counterparts, but obviously they don't stay fresh for long in prime. The Lucid-X Judge does fly a true straight-to-fade line much better than Fuzion or Lucid...but the fade isn't as reliable as you'll get from an Envy. I'd say it's closer to the flight that I get from a powered- down Proxy; a true 0 turn, but only a slight fade.

JB Zones do beat in significantly compared to a fresh Ti or ESP Zone, and is my go-to disc for touch forehands (among a litany of other uses). But I've bagged the same JB Zone for over a year now and it is still not to Envy-level stability, especially when powering down. So I guess it just depends on what you want to use it for, as it could either become a favorite disc in your bag or a disappointment.
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  #58  
Old 03-24-2020, 11:22 AM
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aphilso1 aphilso1 is offline
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Originally Posted by ThrowaEnvy View Post
Sounds like an Envy is in order.. I know what you mean with overlap, I struggle with that constantly.. The trick for me is the same weight, its one more variable to not deal with.

Pick your bag anchors, the rest will change... in and out, kinda like dating in a small community

"You don't lose your girlfriend, you just lose your turn"
Overall I'm actually really happy with the Judges. They hold annies and are more versatile for me than Envies/Proxies were. Envies/Proxies are fantastic driving putters, but I just never got consistent with them for less than full-power throws. And that's really why I was interested in making the switch. For every stroke that the Envy/Proxy combo saved me with a perfect drive, they cost me more when I needed a soft, touchy approach. And since I was already bagging four putter molds (Zone/Envy/Proxy for throwing, Crown for putting) I really didn't want to add a fifth mode just for touch shots. So I hit the reset button, and looked for a disc that could handle all putter duties other than Zone stuff.

Judges do that for me. They feel like a Crown in the hand, so my putting results have stayed basically the same. They are slower so hold touch lines easier. They are stable enough to drive with when fresh (or in Lucid-X plastic). Do I miss having a true driving putter that masks my mistakes on bad form days? Sometimes. But overall I think I'm better off having maximum confidence in two molds, rather than relying on 4-5 different molds to do slightly different things.

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  #59  
Old 03-24-2020, 11:15 PM
deyo7 deyo7 is offline
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Zone, Envy, Proxy guy here too. My Envy is seeing less and less shots though TBH. There is overlap for sure both ways. Roc I added last yr takes some shots away from Envy as well.

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  #60  
Old 03-25-2020, 08:15 AM
aredoubles aredoubles is offline
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Proxy and Zone have been permanent staples in my bag for a couple of years now. I couldn’t find a place for the Envy, I liked the flight but it just didn’t seem to fit my style.
The more useful Proxy/Zone companions for me have been stable glide-less putters with less speed and carry than the Envy, but less beef than the Zone. At various times that’s been an Aviar3, AviarX3, P3x, Berg, or Shield. Gives me a little more predictability and control than the Proxy, but is straighter and more shapeable than the Zone. This is a finicky slot though, I often buy a disc for this role and end up with something that overlaps too much with the Proxy or Zone. At times I find a perfect companion, but then it beats in too much and becomes Proxy-like, and I have to start casting around again, which is where I am right now. If anyone has suggestions for discs similar to the above, I’d love to hear them!
Anyway, that’s the in-between slot that I’ve personally found most useful, and I don’t think the Envy is the right fit for it.
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