#201  
Old 05-16-2020, 07:03 AM
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DavidSauls DavidSauls is offline
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It's a tough battle here in the real world, what with so many invaders.
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  #202  
Old 05-16-2020, 07:33 AM
MikeK MikeK is offline
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Originally Posted by ru4por View Post
I don't even know what you are going on about. Malaria, pneumonia or diarrhoea have been running rampant in third world nations for decades. The socio-economic, cultural and economic environment of those countries, alone, provide for more than enough variable to discount the comparison. The use of African countries to have any semblance of a conversation about COVID, in this country, can only be dismissed as trolling.

This has been a pretty robust thread, and I think everyone understands the need to start the economy. I have seemed to defend the concept of saving as many lives as possible, by limiting the sick, to the capacity of the healthcare system. The real point of the lockdowns and stay at home orders. It worked.

I still have failed to see what your point is. I can only seem to take away that you think your "rights" and convenience should have no price or consequence. You really seem frightened by the faltering economy, as we all are. But, you don't really have anyone to blame. The economy is and will falter until a vaccine is developed and distributed worldwide.

I get you are frightened and you can continue to shout about your rights and what was done wrong yesterday, but the virus will march on. The success of the economy, and with saving lives, is all of us taking the science seriously and trying to do the best by all. It is not hard or that complicated. We all be altruistic, social warriors and both the economy and lives are saved, or everyone does what is best for them and we will mostly fail on both counts. I think we will see how it goes in many places across the country.....by, I say Sept/Oct. Nobody hopes I am wrong, more than me!!
So me posting an opinion from the chief doctor of the United Nations health organization saying the lockdown will probably have unintended consequences of killing poor children across the globe is trolling?

That’s the best you’ve got? Please, spare us all anymore of your sanctimonious crap. You can’t even respect anyone with a differing opinion.
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  #203  
Old 05-16-2020, 07:45 AM
MikeK MikeK is offline
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Rupor do you realize what you sound like?

“Disease has been running rampant in Africa for decades, who cares if more people over there die! We have to save the rich people in America first!”

Are you trolling us?
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  #204  
Old 05-16-2020, 09:38 AM
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So me posting an opinion from the chief doctor of the United Nations health organization saying the lockdown will probably have unintended consequences of killing poor children across the globe is trolling?
Apologies if I missed it, but what actions are you proposing? What do you think is the best balance between public health and economic activity?

I would be genuinely interested to hear your proposal.

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  #205  
Old 05-16-2020, 10:07 AM
LateWesternSky LateWesternSky is offline
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So me posting an opinion from the chief doctor of the United Nations health organization saying the lockdown will probably have unintended consequences of killing poor children across the globe is trolling?
This is like you're saying "my dad is tougher than your dad". You're completely ignoring all the other qualified medical professionals who are saying the lockdowns are a good thing.

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  #206  
Old 05-16-2020, 11:10 AM
MikeK MikeK is offline
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Originally Posted by Monocacy View Post
Apologies if I missed it, but what actions are you proposing? What do you think is the best balance between public health and economic activity?

I would be genuinely interested to hear your proposal.

For the sake of not wasting anyone’s precious time, rather than typing all day, let’s say I am proposing to do whatever they did in Sweden where the rate of infection is less than some places that locked down.
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Old 05-16-2020, 11:13 AM
MikeK MikeK is offline
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This is like you're saying "my dad is tougher than your dad". You're completely ignoring all the other qualified medical professionals who are saying the lockdowns are a good thing.
Leave my dad out of this before I start talking about your mom. I am not completely ignoring other professionals. I don’t think they can put you in the boxcar fast enough if that’s what you interpreted.
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  #208  
Old 05-16-2020, 11:49 AM
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For the sake of not wasting anyone’s precious time, rather than typing all day, let’s say I am proposing to do whatever they did in Sweden where the rate of infection is less than some places that locked down.
Ah the Swedish solution. The U.S. lacks a few things that are keys to Sweden's approach to the pandemic, including early recognition and testing, a robust welfare state, and a high rate of compliance with government recommendations:

A key distinction for Sweden is that its government believed it didn’t need to enforce guidelines regarding social distancing on a population that would heed the advice of the country’s independent public agencies. . . . This trust is a “fundamental element of Swedish society,” said Olofsdotter. “That’s why we can work with recommendations, because most people actually follow them.”

. . .

But Sweden benefits from a robust welfare state that the government has only sought to boost during the pandemic, including an initiative to fast-track sick pay to ensure those with symptoms don’t possibly spread the virus. . . . “It shouldn’t be an economic issue that you go to work no matter what.”

. . .

The country’s economy is heavily dependent on now-snarled global supply chains and is projected to suffer somewhere between a 6 to 7 percent hit to its gross domestic product this year — approximately on par with the United States and Germany.
(Washington Post, May 12, 2020)

Also worth keeping in mind is that Sweden has a COVID-19 death rate that is considerably higher than the U.S.; in fact, Sweden's COVID-19 death rate is one of the highest in the developed world (graph from Business Insider).
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Old 05-16-2020, 11:50 AM
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I guess it depends on what you want to believe.

Americans calling for herd immunity should look at Sweden's coronavirus experiment to see why it won't work


https://www.businessinsider.com/amer...working-2020-5

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  #210  
Old 05-16-2020, 12:00 PM
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From the article I linked above.


As of Friday morning, Sweden, which has a population of 10.23 million, had 29,207 confirmed cases of COVID-19 and 3,646 deaths from the virus — a death rate of 35.64 deaths per 100,000 people.

The US, meanwhile, has had 1.45 million confirmed COVID-19 cases and 86,607 deaths from the virus. With a population of 328.2 million, the country has a death rate of 26.3 deaths per 100,000 people.

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