#1181  
Old 10-20-2019, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by JuanA View Post
That's a very specific target audience.

I feel a starter set without a midrange is a disservice to new players.
I don't know if it's a "disservice", as I can see the thinking that went into it: that it gives newbies more distance but still decent accuracy. It does reflect that mids are becoming 'weapons' for more highly skilled players, but along your line of thinking, newer players are missing out on acquiring the skills to throw a mid well and get great results from them.
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  #1182  
Old 10-20-2019, 08:26 PM
Casey 1988 Casey 1988 is offline
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Originally Posted by SD86 View Post
I don't know if it's a "disservice", as I can see the thinking that went into it: that it gives newbies more distance but still decent accuracy. It does reflect that mids are becoming 'weapons' for more highly skilled players, but along your line of thinking, newer players are missing out on acquiring the skills to throw a mid well and get great results from them.
The way I see it with the right types of midrange disc Slight OS to Slight US are for very new beginners to have a disc they can throw and get some of the longest throws of a disc they have in the bag. The midrange discs that are weapons for more skilled players are often discs not recommended for beginners but a few better players use discs that even a beginner could use in the case of a Buzz from Discraft or a few mid from Innova that are more beginner friendly.

The midrange from most companies could be removed from beginner packs for a disc that is either a midrange like putter that is not too OS or glide less, then even a driver that is like fast midrange as those drivers that much like a midrange as those. Both Types of discs have been around years but only in the last 12-13 years have some of these discs began to be thought of as replacing a midrange. Before 12-13 years ago the midrange like putters that were not too OS were used as very long putters to approach discs mostly and the midrange like drivers were used as woods drivers/tight driving shots, both were not used much as midrange replacement discs.

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  #1183  
Old 10-21-2019, 08:36 AM
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New overmold incoming. The Innova Avatar. Seems strange.

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  #1184  
Old 10-21-2019, 11:26 AM
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New overmold incoming. The Innova Avatar. Seems strange.
Dave D seems to think pretty highly of his overmold babies. Let's see how this one does without Paul parking touchy upshots with it on every Jomez and CCDG upload

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  #1185  
Old 10-21-2019, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SD86 View Post
I don't know if it's a "disservice", as I can see the thinking that went into it: that it gives newbies more distance but still decent accuracy. It does reflect that mids are becoming 'weapons' for more highly skilled players, but along your line of thinking, newer players are missing out on acquiring the skills to throw a mid well and get great results from them.
Yeah, maybe disservice is a bit strong. I'm thinking of that parent though that has no idea what disc golf is, and sees this starter set in the store. Without any guidance, they can spend a long time with their kid trying to figure out how to make a driver fly, whereas a simple Shark could get things clicking quicker.

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  #1186  
Old 10-21-2019, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Alexplz View Post
Dave D seems to think pretty highly of his overmold babies. Let's see how this one does without Paul parking touchy upshots with it on every Jomez and CCDG upload
I've sold 4 Novas in 2019. Last year I sold 51. I stopped carrying the Atlas a number of years ago because 4 of them sat on the shelf for 2 years.

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  #1187  
Old 10-21-2019, 06:24 PM
Casey 1988 Casey 1988 is offline
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I've sold 4 Novas in 2019. Last year I sold 51. I stopped carrying the Atlas a number of years ago because 4 of them sat on the shelf for 2 years.
This is the Paul McBeth affect. Do not forget those who wanted a Nova have one now and being such a blunt nosed putter, the disc will not beat up that quick especially if used mostly as an approach disc. Atlas was more bought back when JK was touring more trying to make her comeback in 2016 as she used that mold, but even then not really popular due to how the mold has the 4 attachment spots.
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  #1188  
Old 10-21-2019, 06:34 PM
Casey 1988 Casey 1988 is offline
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Originally Posted by JuanA View Post
Yeah, maybe disservice is a bit strong. I'm thinking of that parent though that has no idea what disc golf is, and sees this starter set in the store. Without any guidance, they can spend a long time with their kid trying to figure out how to make a driver fly, whereas a simple Shark could get things clicking quicker.
Shark, Mako, Stingray, and Cobra are all good beginner choices. I know the at the time the other Innova made beginner set had the Stingray in it at one point and was the other set besides the one is still sold with a Shark as midrange. You could buy the other set that had the Stingray as mid, Sidewinder as driver and putter a Classic Grid Aviar. That other set was known as the Snake set.
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  #1189  
Old 10-21-2019, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Casey 1988 View Post
This is the Paul McBeth affect. Do not forget those who wanted a Nova have one now and being such a blunt nosed putter, the disc will not beat up that quick especially if used mostly as an approach disc. Atlas was more bought back when JK was touring more trying to make her comeback in 2016 as she used that mold, but even then not really popular due to how the mold has the 4 attachment spots.
It sure did not hurt that McBeast threw the Nova, but it was a pretty good disc anyway. By way of contrast, the Atlas was pretty 'meh' and never caught on. Between the Roc/Roc3 and the Mako3, there was just no real reason to carry an Atlas.
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  #1190  
Old 10-22-2019, 01:57 AM
Casey 1988 Casey 1988 is offline
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Originally Posted by SD86 View Post
It sure did not hurt that McBeast threw the Nova, but it was a pretty good disc anyway. By way of contrast, the Atlas was pretty 'meh' and never caught on. Between the Roc/Roc3 and the Mako3, there was just no real reason to carry an Atlas.
I am saying McBeth using the Nova, the super fans that play disc golf and base a bag off of their favorite player seemed to have moved on to Discraft as the sales have proved it. Now only Bradly Williams really uses the Nova, and he is not as big a name as a Paul McBeth or a Ricky Wysocki.

Due to the Mako/3 there was not a single reason the Atlas needs to be made since the Atlas is only a hair OS compared to the neutral Mako/3 molds. Also the Atlas is a bit odd on the under rim, hurting the sales the disc could have had. I know I would have bought an Atlas a few years after they came out if it not for the odd rim attachment, I was looking for a better flying midrange then the DX Stingray for me.
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