#51  
Old 05-27-2020, 01:16 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Originally Posted by Jugular View Post
So player's have an inflection point (or perhaps a discontinuity) in their make rate by distance (not surprising if it's not linear, but is montonic and ranges between 0%-100%). And so we conclude that around that distance marking your putt is more important than elsewhere. How important it is depends on what your own personal curve looks like.
A curve that makes sense is Cos(Atan((Distance/c1)^c2). Where c1 and c2 are picked to fit the data. It is monotonic, ranges from 0%-100%, approaches very near to 100% for a lot of short distances, and approaches 0% for longer distances. Also, c2 is an exponent, so we can kind of think of it as measuring the degrees of freedom that need to be correct to make a putt.

Here is BuzzChief's (c1 = 26.48, c2 = 2.72):



On this curve, the steepest 8-inch section is from 27 feet 8 inches to 27 feet even. The 8 inches gained by marking with a mini should result in a 2.43% greater chance of making the putt from that distance (68.82% vs 68.38%).

The shortest distance where a mini would make a 1% difference is at 18 feet 2 inches (95.13% vs 94.13%).

The longest distance where a mini would make a 1% difference is at 43 feet 6 inches (26.09% vs 28.09%).
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  #52  
Old 05-27-2020, 01:17 PM
Dingus Dingus is offline
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Originally Posted by Horsman View Post
Kind of how most people dont know how to properly take full advantage of the teepad.
Well now I am curious...
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  #53  
Old 05-28-2020, 11:14 AM
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Horsman Horsman is online now
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Well now I am curious...
Its hard to explain without showing someone, at least for me it is. It seems obvious but you can tee from anywhere on the pad, not just the end closest to the basket. Learning to run up and only using the back of the pad, or using an angled run up is very useful. Its not always easy because more often then not the teepads installed are too small or they are raised.

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  #54  
Old 05-28-2020, 11:16 AM
Dingus Dingus is offline
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Originally Posted by Horsman View Post
It seems obvious
Yeah I guess it does, it wouldn't even cross my mind that people wouldn't understand you can take any angle you want on the teepad.
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  #55  
Old 05-29-2020, 10:48 AM
BillFleming BillFleming is offline
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Originally Posted by Horsman View Post
Its hard to explain without showing someone, at least for me it is. It seems obvious but you can tee from anywhere on the pad, not just the end closest to the basket. Learning to run up and only using the back of the pad, or using an angled run up is very useful. Its not always easy because more often then not the teepads installed are too small or they are raised.
This is why I think courses that have round tee pads have the 'right idea'. The issue/trouble with usual tee pads is that our minds see a straight line and we want to line up on that. It gave me sooooo much trouble when I was starting out. No matter how I lined up on the tee pad, I found my eyes drawn to the edge of the pad and my throw would end up following that line.

I like ball golf's pads where you just have two markers; you can tee up in any direction as long as your ball is in an area defined by the width of the two markers and 6 feet behind them.

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  #56  
Old 05-29-2020, 02:13 PM
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BuzzzChief BuzzzChief is online now
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Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
A curve that makes sense is Cos(Atan((Distance/c1)^c2). Where c1 and c2 are picked to fit the data. It is monotonic, ranges from 0%-100%, approaches very near to 100% for a lot of short distances, and approaches 0% for longer distances. Also, c2 is an exponent, so we can kind of think of it as measuring the degrees of freedom that need to be correct to make a putt.

Here is BuzzChief's (c1 = 26.48, c2 = 2.72):



On this curve, the steepest 8-inch section is from 27 feet 8 inches to 27 feet even. The 8 inches gained by marking with a mini should result in a 2.43% greater chance of making the putt from that distance (68.82% vs 68.38%).

The shortest distance where a mini would make a 1% difference is at 18 feet 2 inches (95.13% vs 94.13%).

The longest distance where a mini would make a 1% difference is at 43 feet 6 inches (26.09% vs 28.09%).
Nice! I had plotted the same thing out in Minitab the other day, but got pulled away to actual work before I could find a good model to fit. This looks fantastic. It matches up pretty well with my non-scientific estimates at 50 feet (15%) and 80 feet (5%). I have a lot of real data out to 30 feet just from using the PP360 app all the time in my backyard.
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  #57  
Old 05-29-2020, 03:53 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Originally Posted by BuzzzChief View Post
Nice! I had plotted the same thing out in Minitab the other day, but got pulled away to actual work before I could find a good model to fit. This looks fantastic. It matches up pretty well with my non-scientific estimates at 50 feet (15%) and 80 feet (5%). I have a lot of real data out to 30 feet just from using the PP360 app all the time in my backyard.
How many total misses from 15 feet went into the 99%?
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  #58  
Old 05-29-2020, 07:05 PM
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How many total misses from 15 feet went into the 99%?
Only 1 miss out of 300. Can’t win them all!
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  #59  
Old 05-29-2020, 07:27 PM
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Horsman Horsman is online now
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Originally Posted by BillFleming View Post
This is why I think courses that have round tee pads have the 'right idea'. The issue/trouble with usual tee pads is that our minds see a straight line and we want to line up on that. It gave me sooooo much trouble when I was starting out. No matter how I lined up on the tee pad, I found my eyes drawn to the edge of the pad and my throw would end up following that line.

I like ball golf's pads where you just have two markers; you can tee up in any direction as long as your ball is in an area defined by the width of the two markers and 6 feet behind them.
Agreed, now if only we can get teepads to be flush to the ground

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  #60  
Old 05-30-2020, 12:07 AM
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armiller armiller is offline
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Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
Good rule of thumb: between gimme range and the circle, use a mini.
This is basically what I do. Like some others, my fragile putting confidence can use the 8 inch confidence boost. And in tournaments, "gimme range" gets closer to the basket. For putts, sometimes I'll use the mini even in circle 2.

And like others, I rarely use minis in the fairways unless I'm throwing the same disc or because of an issue with the lie.

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