#41  
Old 09-09-2013, 02:28 PM
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I think that is a bit much honestly. It's plenty hard already- the Mandos make it seem unfair. Unfair holes are what detract from a course. I think they work better as obstacles in the fairway. It just seems a bit of overkill.
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  #42  
Old 09-09-2013, 02:36 PM
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To me the challenge of the hole is to stay in bounds, not hit any other park patrons with a disc, and to escape the hole with par or +1.
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Old 09-09-2013, 10:54 PM
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The big problem with hole 3 is largely perception. If you ignore the sidewalk on the right (not uncommon to have a hole near a sidewalk) and do everything possible to avoid the ball fields (which is the right play anyway just to stay in bounds and set up for your next shot) what you have left is a hole whose challenge is virtually all artificial. If the OB on the left was actually a natural feature like a lake and the mandos were on mature trees instead of light poles the hole would arguably be the most popular or unique on the course.

People just plain do not like artificial OB and mandos. But the hole from a disc golf standpoint isn't that bad. If the OB was replaced with a lake or yellow rope and you got rid of the mandos/replaced the light poles with mature trees then you'd have a hole that would look right at home at Winny Gold.

The only thing I'd definitely look into changing is removing that last mando b/c I think it rewards luck way more than skill. If a card of pros played that hole, you'd want one maybe two of them to go OB there but as it is now one, maybe two would be lucky to stay in bounds there in my opinion. What you could possibly do is take out that last mando and make one of the trees across from the middle mando a mando left just to reinforce the notion to not blast a drive towards the sidewalk.
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Old 09-10-2013, 09:18 AM
BuzzSharpe BuzzSharpe is offline
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Thumbs up Thank You, Brother Dave!

Thank you, Dave for recognizing the reality. As for that last light pole Mando... It's primarily a safety thing, to keep discers off of the Bremuda grass beyond the outfield fence, as ball players use that area for pre-game warm-up and practice. Plus, it's just easier to set in the course specifics, "all athletic field light poles are Mando..." rather than "all lights poles, except..." And using the OB line and all of the light poles was the only way I could find to get the 1000'+ distance. I have pruned additional pine branches at the green, to hopefully help boost positive perceptions and improve approach probabilities.
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Old 09-10-2013, 05:15 PM
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Ah, hole 3. So much fun. I really felt challenged to end up with a 9 thanks to the last mando I had to throw backwards toward right after I went OB. So pleasing. In my opinion, I think its just not a fair hole, and one that completely ruins a round of golf. When this happens so early in the round, it makes me not want to finish, at all. When I play that hole poorly it makes me pretty much just play a practice round from there on. I'm not sure that's what you're looking for in a course. Most folks just disregard it. I think that the OB is plenty of reason to throw away from the playing fields, but mando or not, unless you straight up hit the thing, its not gonna stop people from making errant throws into the OB areas, and even then it still might send the disc OB, as it did for me today. I think it works better as exactly what it plays as- an obstacle. Honestly, Buzz, your obsession with numbers on this course is just baffling to me- 1000 ft or 985 ft or whatever, its a damn hard hole no matter which way you slice it, when you consider the sloped fairways, the obstacles, the fir trees that stop whatever hits them, the OB's, people on the walking path and park benches and playing fields, and the other Mando's. And while I noticed the new pruning today, it didn't boost anything for me. I didn't have a problem with it before, and I don't think its too big of a help now. In fact, which that bench right behind the basket, I think the trimming actually puts people there in danger of getting hit by a disc now. My two cents worth.

Also, played 8 today. Lost a disc on the right for 30 minutes 4 ft from the fairway. Not pleasing. I saw some trimming had begun, but I heard you say you like the tall grass and are keeping it? Surely you can't mean that! You are asking folks to throw bombs on a 1000+ft hole and expecting them to land in 3 ft tall dense grass? I'm sure that wont stop traffic on the hole at all. The trees I kind of like, but with the right hand side so treacherous, I feel like you have to give players a safe place to land, and 3 ft high rough is not it. Again, an awful lot of folks are laying up on that OB field by the picnic areas to avoid the rough, and I don't expect that to stop if something isn't done to curb the thick stuff. That's my opinion, but again, I've spoken to numerous players on the course and I feel like that's their view as well.

On a plus, I was pleasantly surprised to see 7 and 17 reduced to par 3 and 2 respectively today. I feel both are quite appropriate, as is the par 2 hole 5. Hole 11 on the other hand, plays as a 4 every time I throw it, assuming I don't lose my disc forever on the right, which has happened an awful lot, lol. Everything else seems pretty fair as far as par goes. Keep us posted on when the tee signs are ready so we can help get them in the ground.
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  #46  
Old 09-10-2013, 08:14 PM
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The only thing I want to add about hole 8 is that it would be a good idea from an erosion prevention standpoint to leave a tree alive here and there on that bank. It's also nice for a reference marker for finding your discs easier i.e. "I know it went just left of that tree."

The problem with that last mando on hole 3 is that it pinches the fairway at a really sharp angle, you really have to play that hole with house money in terms of getting good distance with your first couple of throws so that you can lay up just inside that mando to continue the hole w/o major risk of going OB. Otherwise you have to err on the side of the pines b/c an in bounds 'get out of trouble' shot is better than going OB on the left. I need to play that hole at least a few more times before I can say anything definitive.
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  #47  
Old 09-10-2013, 10:48 PM
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I'm gonna have to go play this beast soon so I can be the bigger a-hole than brotherdave. It just ain't right for Dave to be the bad guy. He's usually all warm and fuzzy.
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Old 09-11-2013, 10:12 PM
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I'm usually fuzzy anyway. I prefer to be diplomatic like my man Henry Kissinger. And by that I mean grumble in a hard to hear, monotone German accent that people just assume I know what I'm talking about.

Played it (poorly) today. I really just wanted to see if I could play 3 w/o going OB or missing a Mando. Played it about as well as I could have from the long tee and ended up with a 6. Short of an inch-perfect 300'+ throw at some point on the hole, I don't think I can par this hole from the long tee. I played like crap partly b/c I'm not using FH until my finger heals.

18, lol, I just can't like this hole. I hate uphill holes anyway but the gold tee just sucks. You just have to burn a drive by laying up past the trees and then you can basically start the hole (or whenever the stream of cars and dog walkers cease). Just not a fan at all.

Good job on leveling the tee on hole 13. It's much better now. Need to find a place for those lumps of concrete near the front of the gold tee on hole 11 though, I nearly tripped like mad on my follow through.

Edit: Oh yeah, there was a guy practicing archery on hole 15. That was a first.

Last edited by BrotherDave; 09-11-2013 at 10:15 PM.
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  #49  
Old 09-11-2013, 11:09 PM
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sloppydisc sloppydisc is offline
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This place sounds like a real joy.

Can't wait to go enjoy it. Got some time off coming up, so I'll probably get my chance. Sounds like I should come in body armor to avoid the archer's wrath.
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  #50  
Old 09-12-2013, 12:30 AM
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Tenacious EJ Tenacious EJ is offline
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BrotherDave, he was there the day before too, with his stupid car parked along the curb next to the fairway. I nearly hit his car, so hopefully he moved it.

In the past two days I went OB forward and on the wrong side of the third mando. I've parred the hole exactly one time. My playing partner today made the mando and still went OB. I'm done complaining I guess- I suppose I'll just accept its not a fair hole and take my licks.

And as for 18, the blue tee is just as tough as gold. The tee slopes downhill and the throw is uphill, with a very low tunnel, with OB on either side. Man, its insanely hard to make that shot.
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