#71  
Old 12-01-2019, 11:55 PM
Casey 1988 Casey 1988 is offline
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Originally Posted by Finny View Post
I get what you’re saying, but are there sports that generate lots of revenue where no one watches in person? E-sports, I guess, but are those “sports”? Bowling? Billiards?

For most sports, the in-person audience grew first. Maybe it doesn’t have to be that way for disc golf. But I’m struggling to believe that a huge online audience will develop while no one shows up to watch live.
You need live just not as much as other sports excluding Bowling where they started a livable pro tour in the TV era and bowling places were not really made for spectating. Even with darts you see people on the sides though most of them are tired of seeing the 501 where he person gets it in 3 darts by hitting the inner bulls-eye every single dart with modern darts that are 3 part darts, the dart tip, the middle, and the end that is the plastic with the fletching that generally comes off the plastic part they are not using those they have the darts that are 2 part darts that the tip is on permanent to the middle weighted part with the plastic end and fletching that comes off.
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  #72  
Old 12-02-2019, 01:14 AM
Armus Patheticus Armus Patheticus is offline
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Originally Posted by Casey 1988 View Post
You need live just not as much as other sports excluding Bowling where they started a livable pro tour in the TV era and bowling places were not really made for spectating. Even with darts you see people on the sides though most of them are tired of seeing the 501 where he person gets it in 3 darts by hitting the inner bulls-eye every single dart with modern darts that are 3 part darts, the dart tip, the middle, and the end that is the plastic with the fletching that generally comes off the plastic part they are not using those they have the darts that are 2 part darts that the tip is on permanent to the middle weighted part with the plastic end and fletching that comes off.
The inner bull is worth 50 points, not 167.
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  #73  
Old 12-02-2019, 02:40 AM
Casey 1988 Casey 1988 is offline
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Originally Posted by Armus Patheticus View Post
The inner bull is worth 50 points, not 167.
my bad, I do not play much but I thought if you got 3 throws in a row to the inner bull it was automatic 501. So I guess then in 10-11 throws so whoever gets to go first wins and it is very boring to watch as you know the first guy to go up will win 95% of the time. I only know due to my brother the darts parts him showing me his darts.

Pro Bowling has a bit more to it so splits and other things happen in the game as well as different balls and weights for different situations according to what players want the ball to do.
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  #74  
Old 12-02-2019, 10:26 AM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Originally Posted by jakebake91 View Post
...I'm betting the online viewing was exponentially greater than the people there live. ...
(Apologies to all for this post. Just ignore it if you want to.)

Exponentially does not mean "a lot". It means the bigger something is, the faster it is getting bigger.

The number of on-line viewers could be growing exponentially. For example, there could be twice as many each year.

The number of in-person viewers could also be exponentially greater each year.

But, you cannot compare two different things (in-person vs. on-line viewers) using the expression "exponentially greater".

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  #75  
Old 12-02-2019, 10:52 AM
jakebake91 jakebake91 is offline
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Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
(Apologies to all for this post. Just ignore it if you want to.)

Exponentially does not mean "a lot". It means the bigger something is, the faster it is getting bigger.

The number of on-line viewers could be growing exponentially. For example, there could be twice as many each year.

The number of in-person viewers could also be exponentially greater each year.

But, you cannot compare two different things (in-person vs. on-line viewers) using the expression "exponentially greater".
Okay. Would "substantially greater" have been better? Sorry my word choice rendered my post incomprehensible.
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  #76  
Old 12-02-2019, 11:17 AM
Chains Bailey Chains Bailey is offline
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Originally Posted by Finny View Post
I get what you’re saying, but are there sports that generate lots of revenue where no one watches in person? E-sports, I guess, but are those “sports”? Bowling? Billiards?
Yes - almost all sports do not rely on live spectators. Even something as huge as the NFL - the in person tickets, concessions etc...go only to the teams themselves and much of that is paid to the players. None goes to the NFL (PDGA / Media companies). AD revenue is the largest factor for a sport to grow. In financial terms - No AD revenue = no media = no sport.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finny View Post
For most sports, the in-person audience grew first. Maybe it doesn’t have to be that way for disc golf. But I’m struggling to believe that a huge online audience will develop while no one shows up to watch live.
I agree that sports draw in live audiences and that is important to a small degree, but even in the past, T.V. was the catalyst for any sports growth. Fortunately or unfortunately, I believe we are at a place where live spectators are a non-factor in a sports growth. My guess is that in this day and age it is the huge online audience that will attract other media (ESPN/Cable stations?) and be the model for disc golf to break into the mainstream.

I would defer the subject to Jomez/CCDG/SpinTV and the like for inside knowledge on the subject.

I like the idea of live spectators and it provides good aesthetics. I would assume that any large sponsor would prefer to see people there watching verse not, but if the online presence is huge and they can make money off of the product, then spectators become irrelevant.
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  #77  
Old 12-02-2019, 01:34 PM
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wolfmandragon wolfmandragon is offline
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Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
(Apologies to all for this post. Just ignore it if you want to.)

....

The number of on-line viewers could be growing exponentially. For example, there could be twice as many each year.

...
Nerd alert:

This might be somewhat pedantic, but that is not exponential growth, that is geometric growth.

This is oversimplified but close enough.
Where N is the current number and X is the growth rate:

Linear growth is N times X.
Geometric growth is N to the X power.
Exponential growth is 2 to the N power (no X is used here).

There is also quadratic growth but it is messy and not useful for this discussion. I include this comment in case someone wants to do a deep dive.

All growths can be modeled as one of the above 4. X and N are always real numbers as changing a decimal place does not change the shape of the curve. Yes, in the real world, a decimal place will change the outcome of the final number, but not the domain that it is in.
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  #78  
Old 12-02-2019, 02:17 PM
Steve West Steve West is offline
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Originally Posted by wolfmandragon View Post
Nerd alert:

This might be somewhat pedantic, but that is not exponential growth, that is geometric growth.

....
From https://stats.oecd.org/glossary

Quote:
Geometric growth refers to the situation where successive changes in a population differ by a constant ratio (as distinct from a constant amount for arithmetic change).


Exponential growth refers to the situation where growth compounds continuously at every instant of time.

Because compounding takes place at intervals much longer than an instant, a geometric growth is a “special case” of exponential growth.

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  #79  
Old 12-02-2019, 04:07 PM
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Cgkdisc Cgkdisc is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfmandragon View Post
Nerd alert:

This might be somewhat pedantic, but that is not exponential growth, that is geometric growth.

This is oversimplified but close enough.
Where N is the current number and X is the growth rate:

Linear growth is N times X.
Geometric growth is N to the X power.
Exponential growth is 2 to the N power (no X is used here).

There is also quadratic growth but it is messy and not useful for this discussion. I include this comment in case someone wants to do a deep dive.

All growths can be modeled as one of the above 4. X and N are always real numbers as changing a decimal place does not change the shape of the curve. Yes, in the real world, a decimal place will change the outcome of the final number, but not the domain that it is in.
Must be winter where the stats mavens reside.

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  #80  
Old 12-02-2019, 04:31 PM
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wolfmandragon wolfmandragon is offline
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Originally Posted by Cgkdisc View Post
Must be winter where the stats mavens reside.
I am not good enough at stats to be a maven, but growth rates are very important to programmers building algorithms...

Yes, it's winter.
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