#21  
Old 09-05-2019, 11:57 AM
UhhNegative UhhNegative is offline
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I would argue the X-step typically will ADD accuracy due to making the timing more repeatable and allowing your body to move in the target direction and have that built in targetward momentum. Do we see pros doing standstills even on 250' shots? Not typically, because the timing and direction is easier with an x-step. Does that mean that they can't standstill 400'? Of course not, but given the space, most people are going to do at least a slow x-step.
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  #22  
Old 09-05-2019, 12:05 PM
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roggenb3 roggenb3 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UhhNegative View Post
I would argue the X-step typically will ADD accuracy due to making the timing more repeatable and allowing your body to move in the target direction and have that built in targetward momentum. Do we see pros doing standstills even on 250' shots? Not typically, because the timing and direction is easier with an x-step. Does that mean that they can't standstill 400'? Of course not, but given the space, most people are going to do at least a slow x-step.
Honestly I don't know about pros as I don't watch very much. I would imagine that on 250' no one is doing a run up.

I do differentiate between just a slow 1-2 step x step and a full run up. And in my initial posts the full run up is what I am talking about. Way too many players ALWAYS use an entire run up as if they are on a tee, for any and every shot. It adds way too many variables.

Personally, I don't think people should do even 1-2 steps until they can consistently throw straight from standstill. It's the foundation that the rest is built on. But, ya know, I'm no form expert, or pro level player.

Just my 2 cents based on what I see on the course from my fellow ams.
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Old 09-05-2019, 12:32 PM
UhhNegative UhhNegative is offline
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Originally Posted by roggenb3 View Post
Honestly I don't know about pros as I don't watch very much. I would imagine that on 250' no one is doing a run up.

I do differentiate between just a slow 1-2 step x step and a full run up. And in my initial posts the full run up is what I am talking about. Way too many players ALWAYS use an entire run up as if they are on a tee, for any and every shot. It adds way too many variables.

Personally, I don't think people should do even 1-2 steps until they can consistently throw straight from standstill. It's the foundation that the rest is built on. But, ya know, I'm no form expert, or pro level player.

Just my 2 cents based on what I see on the course from my fellow ams.
I'd say I see at least 90% pros using some sort of x-step even on shorter holes unless it's <200' or very downhill then you see a lot more standstills (like Maple Hill hole 4). While it might not technically be the best, a lot of golf comes down to confidence and that's typically the way most players are comfortable throwing.

But you are right, a full sprint run-up is almost never advised. Even for the top guys on full distance shots, yeah they are coming in with a little more speed than usual, but no more than your typical Am might do with some exceptions.
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Old 09-05-2019, 04:04 PM
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... James Conrad. :-)
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Old 09-05-2019, 08:03 PM
UhhNegative UhhNegative is offline
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... James Conrad. :-)
Yeah, almost mentioned him. He doesn't need the big run up, just mentally he does. He would be an even bigger thrower if his form was better.
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Old 09-06-2019, 01:31 AM
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Originally Posted by TheBeardedFatGuy View Post
Follow through is critical to not straining your back and, unfortunately, becomes less automatic when using a standing throw. The x-step creates momentum that gets partly converted into rotation of the hips and upper body, which helps with follow through. For a standing drive you have to really focus on the weight shift and rotating follow through or you risk wrenching your low back.

It also helps a lot to make sure your off shoulder is mirroring the throwing shoulder, coming fully forward towards the target as the throwing shoulder goes back for the reach back. Doing this winds the upper body spring, ensuring a smoother unwinding rotation that helps both distance and follow through.
I would heed caution. I do agree followthru is critical to safely decelerate, but that is facilitated by your balance/posture and sequence during the throw.

IIRC most spine injuries stem from the backswing transition as you reverse direction which twists/torques the lower spine, especially when a player tries to increase x-factor separation of the hips and shoulders in the backswing and really tries to fire the pelvis into rotation from the rear leg rather than shifting forward from it. Trying to rotate forward also keeps your weight back which makes it harder to followthru on the front leg. Most spine damage is done at the start of the throw rather than after release. You are generating a lot more torque from the lower body early in the throw to the upper body. The followthru is just leftover/dissipated momentum from the upper body pulling the lower body thru.

A more linear followthru will ease tension on the spine, ie less momentum from bracing converted into rotation. The x-step creates more momentum, but is not necessarily safer than a standstill throw. More momentum brings in more risk for injury. It really all depends on your balance/posture and sequence, but with all things being equal the x-step is higher risk and will twist the spine more early in the throw.

Your hips(legs) create the backswing, not your shoulders. The shoulders just follow the hips or move together for the most part or should be. The core muscles resisting hip to shoulder separation from neutral actually creates the spring in the transition forward as the shoulders will lag behind the hips without trying to lag them, you really don't want to add shoulder lag. You really want to try to move them together. The shoulders physically can't lead the hips rotationally. One of the biggest myths in most sports is that your shoulders can lead the throw ahead of the hips rotationally. You can tip or throw the shoulders over the hips, but that's not a rotational sequence issue. That is a balance issue. If you are rotating your shoulders away in the backswing, then you are actually sending your pelvis forward and twisting the spine.

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Old 09-11-2019, 09:26 AM
Smigles Smigles is offline
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It is a matter of preference. I need the x-step to get my timing right. I can't hit a house from 10 feet away when standing still.
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  #28  
Old 09-11-2019, 10:06 AM
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How do you deal with horrible footing that makes an x-step impossible?
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