#41  
Old 08-16-2017, 12:47 AM
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One guy is upset because high rated courses factor to much, one is upset quantity is to much.

One guy says hey the ring is to big, courses can be an hour apart. One guy says it should be bigger.

One guy says 2.5 courses shouldn't be used....
They aren't... what you talking bout Willis.

Also I don't live in Charlotte and hardly ever go there, pump yo brakes.
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  #42  
Old 08-16-2017, 12:49 AM
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Also if places can overlap extensively you could arguably make all 25 spots come out of five areas... that's dumb. You could maybe get them all out of just DFW and Charlotte.

Some do overlap.
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  #43  
Old 08-16-2017, 01:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New013 View Post
So you remember that time I made the thread about my sister doing the stats project and I suggested she use the course database and she did and then she came up with the best places to live for high quality disc golf based on a 30 mile radius?

Well I have been super bored at work lately and I just updated it. If you don't know what I'm talking about go here https://www.dgcoursereview.com/forum...ad.php?t=81083.

The basics are for a course to qualify it has to be in a 30 mile radius from the little red X on the map. It also has to have 5+ reviews and be rated a 3.0 or higher. I also did my super best to not let courses overlap between places except for a select few where they were basically both 30 miles from the X and it was one course overlapping. For the top 30 places I found I also used the browse function to attempt to locate courses not on the map. All the courses within said radius are added and multiplied by the square of the average rating.

Sum * Avg^2

The city listed is either the biggest city near the X or whatever name is nearest the X where there is no big city that close to it. The X's are almost never directly on the dot where the city is located, it's in the premium position to accrue the highest score. Also the <# or ># indicates how many places the city went down <# or up ># from the original list. In cases where the X moved and a different town/city is listed use your brain to figure it out I've done enough.

The following is the Top 25 places for super high quality disc golf. If you don't like how this is done I super don't care it's a list it's made for us to argue about. So argue.

1. Charlotte, NC 1400 >1
2. DFW, TX 1332 <1
3. Quakertown, PA 1159 >8
4. Kansas City, MO 1096 >1
5. Augusta, ME 1071 >1
6. Minneapolis, MN 950 <2
7. Chicago, IL 875 >6
8. St. Louis, MO 837 >17
9. Cincinnati, OH 804 >8
10. Farmington Mills, MI 800 <7
11. Denver, CO 786 <4
12. Worcester, MA 782
13. Portland, OR 772 <1
14. Austin, TX 755 <6
15. Chapel Hill, NC 739 >19
16. Houston, TX 732 >6
17. Atlanta, GA 730 <2
18. Lake Tahoe, CA 724 >6
19. Lancaster, PA 652
20. Tulsa, OK 642 <10
21. Seattle, WA 598 >11
22. Hart, MI 598 <4
23. Reedsville, WI 594 >NR
25. Indianapolis, IN 582 >13
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  #44  
Old 08-16-2017, 01:35 AM
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All of that is factually incorrect except the hand gestures and the dolphin pic. Those are spot on.
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  #45  
Old 08-16-2017, 02:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nemmers View Post
Des Moines, Iowa didn't make the list?
Quote:
Originally Posted by New013 View Post
Des Moines isn't even the best place in Iowa... IOWA
Centering east of Iowa City puts a lot of good courses within 50 miles, most in Iowa, but includes the Quad Cities, too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BionicRib View Post
I'm not sure who wants to argue but, Chicago in the top ten makes me think reviewers need to get out more. Really? Higher than portland, cincy, Tahoe and austin??
Besides reviewer bias, there is also the effect of fewer ratings because of the expectation to write a detailed review. There are a lot of courses that I have not rated because I didn't feel that I could write anything that doesn't just duplicate what has already been said, and I don't feel like having to write all that much sometimes, anyway.

I was not surprised to see California on there other than Tahoe, where the Nevada courses probably make the difference. Some good courses here, but not very concentrated, and there are a lot of mediocre ones.

Someone else mentioned the problem of having a radius with little in the middle, but a lot around the edges. I've seen that in places, and would not consider that anywhere near ideal. I would much rather a have some decent courses within 10 miles than a bunch of great ones that were half an hour away. The former can get played several times a week, if not daily, while the latter might happen only once or twice a week, and in some weather, none. Plus, it maybe should be considered where one would actually live, what it would cost, the quality of life, and traffic. The center of a ring with the courses out at the edge might mean living on a farm, or in the middle of a city where there is so much traffic that 30 miles takes over an hour to drive. Chicago, Philadelphia, most of California, etc., housing might be rather unaffordable, scarce, in a bad area, etc.

Anyway, whatever the discussion, quibbling, or objections, thanks for the list!
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  #46  
Old 08-16-2017, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Horsman View Post
What was used for Reedsville, WI? The best I have been able to get was in the 400's only.
Rollin Ridge
Winnebago Green
Lower Cato Falls
Grignon
O'Hauser
LTC Cleveland
Plamann Apple
Jaycee Park
Silver Creek
Vollrath
Triangle Sports
Winter Park

Quote:
Originally Posted by BuiltTooLong View Post
There ain't **** in the city of Chicago. If you said Joliet, that would make more sense. Also, The Canyons blows away Highland and its not close. Leaving off hotspots like Davenport, IA (Quad Cities) or Des Moines, IA and having Chicago on this list makes it just nonsensical. If you were in Chicago it would take over an hour drive to find a course that is 4 stars.
As Mr. Sauls pointed out, I pointed out that most of the time the city named is just the nearest known city if it's pretty close or the X is essentially in it's suburbs which for Chicago is a pretty big area. The X is actually at Orlando Park which is about 20 miles from the Chicago DOT. There are two 4 star courses about 10 miles from there... it might take you an hour because of traffic and I never said this factored that in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BuiltTooLong View Post
Yes, but the goal was the best place to live for high quality disc golf. I had an internship in Chicago for 3 months and to try to get a round of disc golf in somewhere was absolutely BRUTAL. There are hundreds of cities that would be preferable over Chicago if you are looking to play a lot of disc golf.
I've never lived in Chicago but I'm guessing traffic IN CHICAGO is brutal and I'm guessing any course near the city is crushed with chuckers. However Orlando Park has a solid grouping of courses very near it, not on the 30 mile edge as some seem to chalk all of them up to.

I'll also point out that in the 30 mile radius from Orlando Park there are 18 courses that are considered "Good" or better. That's the 4th most courses in the radius and it ties Augusta, ME, Minneapolis, MN, St. Louis, MO and Cincinnati, OH. Orlando Park actually has a higher average than the last two.

Now check their scores, there is a 267 point score between the 1st and 5th area that all have the exact same amount of qualifying courses. That's a pretty big difference for something that doesn't factor in... quality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve West View Post
That's the trouble with using "within a radius". You tend to find places with a ring of courses out near the edge of the radius. Use a radius of 125 miles and you'd think a boat in the middle of Lake Michigan is the best place.
We argued this the first time Steve and if you remember I agreed with you that it definitely should be weighted from the marker to be the most accurate. My sister created all of this and she doesn't even care about disc golf she was just trying to get a grade. However as you know getting all these stats together takes time and I was just doing this in my down time because I literally had nothing else to do. I don't have the desire to take enough time to go back and weight them while also figuring out the optimum spots for the weighting.

I do however disagree when you say, well just go to 125 miles. That doesn't make sense, most of these places are metropolitan areas and 30 miles in such an area isn't really that far for a day trip. I've driven that far to play doubles or just with people I know a **** ton. 125 miles from a spot is generally not a day trip or your average going to play a course today... neither is 60 miles.

I also take issue with your use of "problem". At the end of the day it's a preference thing and we're all going to be different. Some people might rather have one great course right next to them and 10 solid courses about half hour away. Some people might rather have 10 solid courses next to them and one great one a half hour away.

Say there's an area with 1 great course 60 miles east of a place with 6 just good courses. Pick where you'd rather live... Do you live way in the east so you got 1 great course and have to drive 60 miles to play anything else? Do you live way in the west with 6 okay courses and a 60 mile drive to a great course. Or do you live more towards the middle where you have the option to go either way and not have to drive 60 miles anytime you feel like changing things up? It's a preference, not a problem.
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Old 08-16-2017, 11:49 AM
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I don't think Steve was advocating for a 125-mile radius. I took as just a vivid illustration of a ring.
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Old 08-16-2017, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bhadella View Post
Suck it DFW! CLT 4 lyfe! No really, DFW crew, I land in DFW at 5:55pm on Wednesday night. Where should I play that night (after I grab my rental car)?
Hopefully somewhere with precipices/water to the right of every basket.
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Old 08-16-2017, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doofenshmirtz View Post
Well, in claiming that your list is a ranking of the top place for "super high quality" disc golf, you are advertising a ranking whose method really doesn't add up to that. However, it makes more sense given your number one and your location.
Actually it does a decent job of it, I just don't think you math well. As was already pointed out by somebody else who was complaining that the quantity isn't represented well enough, 10 3.5 rated courses would score lower than 5 4.5 rated courses. If this doesn't factor in quality then how could that be?

ATL ended up in 17th place with a score of 730. ATL has 17 qualifying courses with an average of 3.572. There are 7 areas ahead of ATL that all have less qualifying courses; Portland and Denver both have 13 qualifying courses (4 less) and are 42 and 56 points ahead of ATL respectively.

Denver is only 18 points behind Cincy and Cincy has 5 more courses than Denver. Yes we all know Denver peeps are full of it with their course ratings that's another discussion . How could these things be true if it doesn't factor in quality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doofenshmirtz View Post
you truly want to tease out the "super high quality" of a location, then you should start by not limiting it to 30 miles or using any component in your equation that simply counts the number of courses. Why would a course with a 2.5 rating be factored into such a calculation at all other than to just allow the quantity of courses to affect the ranking? Also, why would you care about overlap? Either a location fits the criteria or not?
This maketh no senseth. First you have to limit it to a distance unless you weight distance which I addressed with Steve already. I also addressed that anything more than 30 miles is more than your typical I'm going to play today while doing other things besides this kind of deal... especially because many of these are in metropolitan areas.

2.5 courses are not factored in.

This equation does not simply count courses as I already pointed out. The average is squared to specifically boost quality while also acknowledging having more courses considered good or better is still an advantage over another area. One more example is Dike, TX and Rochester, NY. Dike has 5 qualifying courses and Rochester has 9; almost twice as many. They scored the same score. If quality isn't a factor then that would never happen. Now if your argument is I'd rather live in Dike, TX with those 5 than Rochester, NY with those 9 that's a valid argument but some disagree, like the dude who commented earlier.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doofenshmirtz View Post
so many factors unrelated to quality in your formula, it almost looks like you designed it specifically to make one location look better than others . . . . .
SO MANY!!! there's three factors. Distance, Sum and Average. Distance only determines how many courses are in the equation, not whether quality or quantity is weighted heavier. The sum does lean towards weighting for quality but also factors in quality because a place with higher quality will add up faster with fewer courses. The average exclusively factors in quality and it is squared. So basically both weighting factors account for quality and the one that is exclusively about quality is squared to weight even more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doofenshmirtz View Post
better way to measure would be simply counting the number of courses rated 3.75 or higher within a 60 mile radius. Why 60 miles? Because, in most cases, that is going to be about an hour drive. It is also a more realistic criteria for a traveling golfer which makes this method less about how awesome you think it is where you live as opposed to where you might like to travel to play. 60 miles also eliminates any Lake Michigan ferries.

So the admittedly incomplete, non-Charlotte-biased list that only counts high quality courses within 60 miles of a location comes up with:

1. Portland, ME 19
2. Denver 16
2. Lansing 16
4. Dallas 15
5. Philadelphia 13
6. Tahoe City 12
6. Charlotte 12
8. Hartford 11
8. Worcester 11
8. Milwaukee 11
11. Baltimore 10
12. Chicago 10
13. Detroit 10
14. Springfield, MA 9
14. Columbus, OH 9
14. Muskegon 9
14. Buffalo 9
18. Austin 8
19. Madison 8
I never said this was about traveling golfers, if anything it's more about people that live there. I do think this list can be a helpful tool for traveling golfers but admit it's not the end all be all of where to go. It just combines things I like such as lists, silly stats, disc golf courses and pissing people off not from NC who are envious that we are the best.

...and wait, you complained about a list just adding up courses then said here's a better list that just added up courses not factoring in which places have a higher average? Hmmm...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doofenshmirtz View Post
My thought was that if you are looking for the number of high quality courses, then just list the number of high quality courses. I can usually only pay 3-4 courses, at most, on my typical trips so 100 courses rated below 3.75 is no lure to me. In fact, 3-4 4.5 courses is better for me no matter the total.
Wait so now you admit this list is exactly for you because places with a few high quality courses are better than a place with a bunch of just good courses and this list boosts places with a high average? Sweet thanks for agreeing with me.
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  #50  
Old 08-16-2017, 12:08 PM
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This is also where I admit I totally ****ed up just like when I left Highbridge off the first list. I'm surprised nobody caught it.

Augusta, GA is actually 19th on the list.

I must of overlapped it with Augusta, ME at some point and left it out.

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