#81  
Old 12-11-2018, 07:49 PM
Steve West Steve West is online now
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Originally Posted by Dan Ensor View Post
...Friends will allow time to choose a shot. ...
Like, say, about 30 seconds?
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  #82  
Old 12-11-2018, 08:30 PM
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Dan Ensor Dan Ensor is offline
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Like, say, about 30 seconds?
No. That would be unreasonably long for a tap-in, and unreasonably short if I'm throwing a cut roller from the bottom of a ravine.
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  #83  
Old 12-11-2018, 08:33 PM
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Dan Ensor Dan Ensor is offline
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I might give them 32 seconds at the lie.
You should be disqualified.

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  #84  
Old 12-12-2018, 08:58 AM
cheesethin cheesethin is offline
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Originally Posted by Dan Ensor View Post
....
Quick thought experiment.

We are in a sanctioned tournament (not a casual round). You and I and the rest of the card throw our tee shots and then we walk at a comfortable pace down the fairway, having a friendly chat as we go, and you being the away player, we arrive at your disc first. You have a tricky lie behind a tree. The playing area is clear and free of distraction. You and I are stood right next to your disc, we drop our bags on the floor, and I turn to you and say "Hey, do you feel you have had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine your lie?"

What's your answer?

YES - The rules allow anyone on the card to start the timer on you and to give you 30 seconds from that point to execute your shot. Disc selection and shot selection must be done within that 30 seconds.

NO - Then on what grounds do you think you have not had 'a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine the lie'? (802.03 Excessive Time)

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  #85  
Old 12-12-2018, 11:39 AM
EarthRocker EarthRocker is offline
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Originally Posted by DoWork View Post
The 30 second rule exists as a guide to keep things moving, not as a weapon to intimidate newer players with.
I believe this bears repeating. It's the most concise and cogent comment about all this that I've seen so far.

Which is not to disparage anyone else's take on it. I just feel like the game of golf (both types) does have, built into its rules and conventions, a gentlemanly aspect that is often overlooked in the heat of a competitive fire...

Can we not find ways to enforce rules without being hardasses about it? I think we can. But there's that dadgum BOOK everyone points to. Me? Don't own a copy.

(Lots of lawyer-ish hair-splitting going on, too. I understand the impetus, but feel those dissection-arguments miss the point sometimes.)

The game is just that: a game. Keeping up with the group in front shouldn't be the yardstick; it should be keeping ahead of the group behind. These are often unrelated.

I choose to ignore most talk about pace of play, anyway. I've almost never seen it enforced on the course, first of all. Secondly, for me, anyway, the more time I spend out there, the better. So when Bubba takes *gasp* 42 seconds to take his shot, not only do I not mention it, I don't even notice it. I'm too busy looking at birds and foliage, and thinking about my own damn game.

But by all means, carry on! It's always fun reading.

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  #86  
Old 12-12-2018, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by cheesethin View Post
Quick thought experiment.

We are in a sanctioned tournament (not a casual round). You and I and the rest of the card throw our tee shots and then we walk at a comfortable pace down the fairway, having a friendly chat as we go, and you being the away player, we arrive at your disc first. You have a tricky lie behind a tree. The playing area is clear and free of distraction. You and I are stood right next to your disc, we drop our bags on the floor, and I turn to you and say "Hey, do you feel you have had a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine your lie?"

What's your answer?

YES - The rules allow anyone on the card to start the timer on you and to give you 30 seconds from that point to execute your shot. Disc selection and shot selection must be done within that 30 seconds.

NO - Then on what grounds do you think you have not had 'a reasonable amount of time to arrive at and determine the lie'? (802.03 Excessive Time)
"That's what we're doing today?" *Pulls out Polecat and parks it* *Prepares for the least fun round ever*

It's not my call. I suppose I could also ask my cardmates what they think. Risky, though, since it probably takes more than 30 seconds.
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  #87  
Old 12-13-2018, 04:09 AM
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Originally Posted by EarthRocker View Post
I just feel like the game of golf does have a gentlemanly aspect.
My interpretation is gentlemanly. The other interpretation is Hack-a-Shaq.
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  #88  
Old 12-13-2018, 09:36 AM
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Discette Discette is offline
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Originally Posted by JC17393 View Post
There's a line between "gaming" any rule to one's advantage and simply enforcing a rule properly. And it's not a fine line, it's a broad bold line. However, in my experience in disc golf, there are way too many people who view [s]plain old[/s] ANY enforcement of a rule as "gaming". Makes it very difficult to enforce the rules when that enforcement too often gets painted as something underhanded or nefarious.

Also makes it tough to have earnest discussions of rules interpretation and enforcement if one side's argument is enforcing a rule is an unwelcome act of aggression.

Rules Nazi!






Because what discussion of the rules would be complete without the N word.

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  #89  
Old 12-14-2018, 10:57 PM
araytx araytx is offline
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Originally Posted by Dan Ensor View Post
It seems here that you want to have your cake and eat it too. IMO, it has to be either the 30 seconds immediately after conditions being met, or 30 continuous seconds of all conditions being met.

I see the 30 seconds to be pointed exclusively at the pre-shot routine, which would be repeated in full after a distraction.

...


Since there is no definition given, distraction is decided by the group. Even I won't let you pause for the wind.
I NEVER SAID the wind itself would be the distraction I could call. I said something blowing across my line of sight, which, on a windy day, is true. It'll happen more often than every 30 seconds. So the "reset the clock" philosophy is dead in the water right there.

You can't have it both ways. You can't say, the player gets a full re-set and another full "30-consecutive-seconds" after a legitimate distraction in one breath, and then say, "but if the player calls said same distraction 3 or 4 straight times he's gaming the rules." It's one or the other. Either that distraction (leaves or paper or old picnic table cloth blowing across my line of sight -- or cars, etc.) is a legit distraction or it is not. And whatever you assert is the correct rule then must follow.

And btw, where is it written that the group decides what constitutes "the throwing area is free from distractions"? That sounds like a convenient way to contradict my assertion. Plus what if the group decides that the gusty wind blow a loft of 10-20 leaves at a time IS a distraction for player A on hole #1, then when I make the same call on hole #3 over and over again, they suddenly change to A Ray is gaming the rules so that's a violation. How in the world can that be legit?
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  #90  
Old 12-14-2018, 11:07 PM
araytx araytx is offline
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Originally Posted by Dan Ensor View Post

There is a dedicated 30 second thread, but who wants to necrobump?
btw, I've tried doing the search and haven't found the 30-seconds thread. I'll be happy to move my discussions over there.
Any help in providing that link is appreciated.
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